Fox Kids/Jetix & Saban Library - Missing on Disney+

[John Pannozzi]

Our wealth, my friend, is very limited. Do you believe that with these wealths we can buy TWDC stock and buy enough shares to influence decisions like the big players or billionaires?

I dunno.

Funny, last I checked, Bob Iger's net worth was only in millions, not billions. Hmmm...

 

[GRPHX]

I dunno.

Funny, last I checked, Bob Iger's net worth was only in millions, not billions. Hmmm...

I'm just exaggerating, man. My point was to point out that even if we bought stock in Disney or any other public company, we wouldn't be one of the big players. Focus on the main idea or maybe you're just trying to make fun of me. I don't care either way. I'm so fed up.

 

[Two Two's]

What angers me is the fact after 2012/2013, the BVS library essentially became dormant. We live in an era where perservation for animation is at it's absolute peak, yet for BVS Entertainment, we are still relying on TV-rips and some shows, outright lost. We've got streaming services like Netflix, Peacock, Hulu and to some extent, YouTube (which essentially became the un-official home of these beloved classics). Disney's own streaming service lacks BVS content and their attempt at "reunifying the Disney brand" therefore has failed. With the expection of Marvel's own shows.

 

[modernponderer]

That's why, for the moment, I consider the list being fake. If it would have been true, these shows wouldn't have missed.

I do think omissions, as opposed to incorrect inclusions, are sadly quite possible as there is no legal issue with NOT including a show you own in your catalog (unlike claiming somebody else's show).

And the lists are (or were) clearly not well-maintained, particularly given the huge "uncategorized" group which seems to dump a bunch of shows just to get them listed with as little effort as possible.

Do you have a version of this list that lists ABC/Touchstone and other general entertainment titles?

No, as I recall there were similar pages on the same website which may have also been cached, but I barely managed to save the info I did (even having to go through the HTML source as it was a mess).

There are some small bits and pieces of the website saved in the Internet Archive, at least proving it was once publicly accessible, but unfortunately none of the lists were archived as far as I can tell.

By the way how did you choose to ignore the detail that half of SIP was owned by BVS from 2018-2024 and consider it an independent studio?

Once again: nobody "ignored" this detail; this information was simply not available when writing the article. We had only the following two facts related to this, and that is exactly what the article stated:

• "Disney" (unspecified) purchased 49% of SIP - which is technically true, albeit perhaps misleading.
• Disney France serves as a contact point for SIP - which is correct, even if it may be misinterpreted.

 

[JulianRO]

I do think omissions, as opposed to incorrect inclusions, are sadly quite possible as there is no legal issue with NOT including a show you own in your catalog (unlike claiming somebody else's show).

And the lists are (or were) clearly not well-maintained, particularly given the huge "uncategorized" group which seems to dump a bunch of shows just to get them listed with as little effort as possible.

I don't think Disney would skip adding some shows, especially as, if you said that the list is from 2019 at most, then there are still numerous gaps.

Also, I notice that "Honeybee Hutch" and "Samurai Pizza Cats" appear on the list, but I'm 100% sure Disney doesn't own those.

 

[MTAF1976]

and Sweet Valley High is Lost Media againView attachment 312386

SHOWS ARE NOT LOST MEDIA WHEN THEY ARE SIMPLY NOT ON STREAMING OH MY GOD PEOPLE MISUSE THAT TERM SO MUCH

Random thought: maybe some of us should buy Disney stock and see if we could convince them to do something with the Saban/Fox Family/etc. catalog. It probably wouldn't amount to much, but I'd like to point out that common folk can buy stock in publicly traded corporations.

to buy enough Disney stock to seriously lobby the company would cost millions

I don't think Disney would skip adding some shows, especially as, if you said that the list is from 2019 at most, then there are still numerous gaps.

Also, I notice that "Honeybee Hutch" and "Samurai Pizza Cats" appear on the list, but I'm 100% sure Disney doesn't own those.

yep Samurai Pizza Cats along with some other shows like Pucca and Mon Colle Knights (though Discotek had to go through Disney to get the dub) expired many years ago. However, I think Disney still own the US rights to the Littl' Bits because that show hasn't seen any form of modern US release.

It's also worth noting that most likely Disney's rights to the Dungeons and Dragons 80s cartoon have expired at some point as a free channel on Amazon Prime (formerly Freevee) carries the show.

 

[John Pannozzi]

I'm just exaggerating, man. My point was to point out that even if we bought stock in Disney or any other public company, we wouldn't be one of the big players. Focus on the main idea or maybe you're just trying to make fun of me. I don't care either way. I'm so fed up.

My apologizes if my comments offended you.

 

[JulianRO]

If that list is indeed true, then it shocks me how Disney has two shows based on the "Little Mermaid" story: their version, and the Saban one.

 

[GRPHX]

We all thought Jeremy Zag and Jacqueline Tordjman were carrying on the legacy of SIP Animation at ZAG Entertainment, but how many of us knew that one of ZAG's partners is Haim Saban.

Newsroom | Business Wire

The global leader in press release distribution and regulatory disclosure. Public relations and investor relations professionals rely on Business Wire for broad-based and targeted market reach.

www.businesswire.com

This indirectly means that Haim Saban is still doing business with Disney.

Jeremy Zag has already taken on former SIP employees when he founded the company and said he was inspired by Haim Saban's business model. So ZagToon is the spiritual successor to Saban Entertainment.

 

[modernponderer]

So ZagToon is the spiritual successor to Saban Entertainment.

If only the quality of their shows were anywhere near what Saban - or more specifically SIP - achieved...

But maybe it's not really possible these days - even in France, I recall the creator of Oban Star-Racers talking about how any sort of revival is difficult largely because the cartoon industry simply doesn't want "complex" shows anymore. In fact, many animation studios have pivoted to preschool cartoons entirely as that's pretty much the only market where there is money to be made for them now.

 

[GRPHX]

If only the quality of their shows were anywhere near what Saban - or more specifically SIP - achieved...

But maybe it's not really possible these days - even in France, I recall the creator of Oban Star-Racers talking about how any sort of revival is difficult largely because the cartoon industry simply doesn't want "complex" shows anymore. In fact, many animation studios have pivoted to preschool cartoons entirely as that's pretty much the only market where there is money to be made for them now.

That's exactly it. In fact, the status of being a spiritual successor is valid corparately, not qualitatively.

I would love to see a Diabolik animated series again, for example. But I know that won't happen. We're not even getting the one that exists yet. The real problem is that the growing animation market for adults either refuses to produce complex shows and only produces humorous shows or abandons the market to anime.

We get that you can't make it for kids, but what's stopping you from making it for adults? Why is there forced humor even in an espionage-themed show with a great art style like Archer? When there should be more intrigue, drama, and conspiracy?

 

[PrevueLovesAnimeTV]

We all thought Jeremy Zag and Jacqueline Tordjman were carrying on the legacy of SIP Animation at ZAG Entertainment, but how many of us knew that one of ZAG's partners is Haim Saban.

Newsroom | Business Wire

The global leader in press release distribution and regulatory disclosure. Public relations and investor relations professionals rely on Business Wire for broad-based and targeted market reach.

www.businesswire.com

This indirectly means that Haim Saban is still doing business with Disney.

Jeremy Zag has already taken on former SIP employees when he founded the company and said he was inspired by Haim Saban's business model. So ZagToon is the spiritual successor to Saban Entertainment.

Their Flagship Programme (Co-Owned with KKR's Mediawan) airs on Disney

 

[Moe]

It is not just Disney abandoned most of Jetix/Saban/BVS contents, also Disney abandoned a lot of their own contents too that haven't air on Disney Channel since premium era (1983-1997) and basic-premium hybrid era (1997-2002). Some libraries never air again after premiere on ABC, NBC and CBS between 1950s and 1990s. Where is Tiger Town (1983)? Flash (1997)? Those media are lost.

Real shame on Disney. I do think that Disney should start to work with Weigel to air Saban/BVS contents on MeTV Toons.

Random thought: maybe some of us should buy Disney stock and see if we could convince them to do something with the Saban/Fox Family/etc. catalog. It probably wouldn't amount to much, but I'd like to point out that common folk can buy stock in publicly traded corporations.

It is very hard and tedious to do it and we don't have wealth, so if we did and Disney would put more money in stock to beat us.

Bob Iger has over $700 millions, but it don't include the investments and stocks that could be over billion dollars.

 

[modernponderer]

That's exactly it. In fact, the status of being a spiritual successor is valid corparately, not qualitatively.

I would love to see a Diabolik animated series again, for example. But I know that won't happen. We're not even getting the one that exists yet. The real problem is that the growing animation market for adults either refuses to produce complex shows and only produces humorous shows or abandons the market to anime.

We get that you can't make it for kids, but what's stopping you from making it for adults? Why is there forced humor even in an espionage-themed show with a great art style like Archer? When there should be more intrigue, drama, and conspiracy?

Well, just like with the other issues discussed here, I'm afraid all we can really do is try to get people to remember these shows and how they were made. Popularity generally means money, yet many series like these are sadly obscure hence easily ignored even by the very companies that made or own them.

My own work for W.I.T.C.H., correcting countless misperceptions about the brilliant writing, seems to have suddenly started to pay off. Whereas the consensus seemed to be it was a poor adaptation that was hardly worth a watch, now more and more people seem to realize what an incredible job it did. I feel like it may be at a tipping point where it gets just enough popularity to catch Disney's attention.

And I've wanted to say this for while: I think you did the same for me, at least, with Diabolik. Your quite amazing passion here was perhaps the main inspiration for me to watch not only your favourite series, but also numerous other Saban shows which I found in fact have DVD releases in English. In turn, I have finally documented said releases on Wikipedia, so Disney cannot simply "memory hole" them anymore!

(By the way, while Diabolik has surprisingly thrilling writing in some of the episodes, Princess Sissi turns out to be even better: a shockingly underrated show with serious themes of historical conflict. It may be the only cartoon I've ever found with absolutely perfect continuity - like one huge, 52-part-long movie. Of course, neither show is at the level of W.I.T.C.H., but I consider that the best cartoon ever made so...)

 

[GRPHX]

Well, just like with the other issues discussed here, I'm afraid all we can really do is try to get people to remember these shows and how they were made. Popularity generally means money, yet many series like these are sadly obscure hence easily ignored even by the very companies that made or own them.

My own work for W.I.T.C.H., correcting countless misperceptions about the brilliant writing, seems to have suddenly started to pay off. Whereas the consensus seemed to be it was a poor adaptation that was hardly worth a watch, now more and more people seem to realize what an incredible job it did. I feel like it may be at a tipping point where it gets just enough popularity to catch Disney's attention.

And I've wanted to say this for while: I think you did the same for me, at least, with Diabolik. Your quite amazing passion here was perhaps the main inspiration for me to watch not only your favourite series, but also numerous other Saban shows which I found in fact have DVD releases in English. In turn, I have finally documented said releases on Wikipedia, so Disney cannot simply "memory hole" them anymore!

(By the way, while Diabolik has surprisingly thrilling writing in some of the episodes, Princess Sissi turns out to be even better: a shockingly underrated show with serious themes of historical conflict. It may be the only cartoon I've ever found with absolutely perfect continuity - like one huge, 52-part-long movie. Of course, neither show is at the level of W.I.T.C.H., but I consider that the best cartoon ever made so...)

You are absolutely right about Sissi, although it is a loose animation-drama that is not strongly tied to real history, it is unique in its art style and approach to the subject, although traumatic for young minds. When I was a kid, I would have simply found it complicated or boring and would not have watched it, but if it were today, I would definitely give it a chance, it is an original production like every production of SIP. While the rights to this production are still owned by Disney except for Canada, how can Sissi not be considered a Disney princess when even Anastasia is considered a Disney princess? This is terrible. I think the same about Marina. Like all of Saban's productions, it may be cheap, but it has a much more complex and powerful plot than Ariel. However, I disagree about W.I.T.C.H. First, in my opinion, this show is a production that has managed to stand out from the BVS and SIP brands within the existing BVS library, apart from Marvel-related content, and is positioned by fans as a Native Disney show similar to Susie Q. Second, when I consider W.I.T.C.H. as a whole, I do not find it better than Diabolik. The reason is that, except for W.I.T.C.H.'s wonderful fantasy world of meridian and interdimensionality, all the main characters are 12-year-old girls and they are not very interesting without their magical powers. Sissi is a matter of taste, but when compared to Diabolik, it seems more like a reflection of the 90s Telenovela culture in animations. Still, I accept the originality of every content that SIP produces and for this reason, I do not want anyone to separate one of these shows from the other, I think that all of them should be given the love they deserve because these kinds of shows are no longer produced in the western animation world today. Anime, unlike western animations, is too cultural and has a "love the genre or hate the genre" mentality. Unfortunately, I am on the hate side.

First of all, thank you for your valuable answer. Frankly, I have been working since January 2022 to remind Saban/BVS's corporate existence, which was left to rot by Disney, and to create meaningful data by collecting the remaining ones. Normally, this was an American company and had a production culture based in France. Those who should have made this effort were Americans or French before me, but I obtained these findings by scanning sources such as USTPO and LoC. I actually even wrote the article at the beginning of this forum, and I just asked a friend of mine to appear as the author. I couldn't get the masses to follow me, but if it wasn't me, no one else would have done it, even on this forum, I got cyberbullied whenever I mentioned it, but I'm happy now, at least we have a community, we have articles edited on Wikipedia, and we have more proof of what Disney owns. This saves this library from being obscure anymore. None of the changes made by me on Wikipedia in the last year were actually major changes. They should have been made by now.

By the way, the recent changes you made to wikipedia were also very useful.

But, as we saw with re vaulted of Sweet Valley High, on the other hand, it doesn't seem to make a difference for Disney.

I don't know what to say at a time when even EA is releasing The Sims and The Sims 2 digitally to celebrate its 25th anniversary. Disney making the BVS library accessible again seems even more impossible than The Sims. I used to dream about EA making The Sims accessible again, and it always seemed impossible to me, or Tommy Vercetti floating in the water until GTA Vice City Next-Gen Edition came out. In that respect, the BVS library is even more impossible to release than either of those two.

Disney is somehow a worse company than EA. Very bad, but of course not as bad as the antichrist institution Take-Two Interactive. But I think it takes a serious feat to be worse than EA. They clearly messed up this global launch. They tried to apply the same logic that they did in America to the entire world. If they had put Diabolik, W.I.T.C.H., Princess Sissi, Wunschpunsch (at least in the Eastern European launch) and done what I said instead of wasting money on those stupid Turkish, Spanish or French series, they would have gained a much more loyal subscriber base at a much lower cost. They fell victim to regional branches and malicious regional industry lobbies. That, my friend, is a poor understanding of the market. Then they removed all of that and ended global dub support. When the EA CEO comes, they say after Bob, I hope he does. Disney's streaming business can't get any worse. The way they handled all those originals in my own country, especially with OUR SUPREME NATIONAL LEADER Mustafa Kemal Atatürk, was a PR disaster. Anyway, this was too long and detailed. I'd like to wrap things up. The wrong decisions made in a chain and the lack of interest of the fans have brought us to this point, which has already made them easily forgettable for an institution like Disney, which is prone to abandoning all its content to the vault. As I said, if Disney's classics and these contents had found a place for themselves globally, Disney would not have suffered more than it is doing now, but at least they would have made people happy. They made everyone unhappy, they did not keep their promises (they did not keep their original productions), and they were left with a very bad reputation and a platform that no one could trust. I will simplify this much more, my dear friends, I wanted to watch complicated or long-running series that are not available today such as Alias, Angel, 24, Devious Maids, Revenge, The X-Files, Ally McBeal and Desperate Housewives produced between the 90s and 2010s, dubbed in my own language on this platform and I was excited and eager for this, but Disney could not even provide this. This was a problem that needed to be solved before BVS and Fox Kids library, at this point I may have better explained how distant Disney's old cartoon library is for us simple consumers.

 

[GRPHX]

Power Rangers Is Back At Disney, 20 Years After They Gave Us Some Of The Franchise's Best Shows

A new Power Rangers show is reportedly happening.

screenrant.com

WTF are you doing Disney! You entirely ruined and confused everything. Well done!

I wonder whether which subsidiaries Disney still hasn't dissolved, BVS Entertainment or MMPR Productions, will take any active role in the production of this new show.

 

[Moe]

Power Rangers Is Back At Disney, 20 Years After They Gave Us Some Of The Franchise's Best Shows

A new Power Rangers show is reportedly happening.

screenrant.com

WTF are you doing Disney! You entirely ruined and confused everything. Well done!

I wonder whether which subsidiaries Disney still hasn't dissolved, BVS Entertainment or MMPR Productions, will take any active role in the production of this new show.

Power Rangers is going to be acquired show and produced at Hasbro studio, rather than Disney or 20th Century studios.

Power Rangers haven’t find a home after Netflix dumped them and before, Nickelodeon dumped them in 2021 after been a home for 10 years.

 

[GRPHX]

Power Rangers is going to be acquired show and produced at Hasbro studio, rather than Disney or 20th Century studios.

Power Rangers haven’t find a home after Netflix dumped them and before, Nickelodeon dumped them in 2021 after been a home for 10 years.

I know the entire property hasn't been repurchased from Hasbro but it's interesting that they're re-sticking to a property they kicked out of.

I wish this was a chance for other BVS properties but it won't happen... It's weird and sickening to forget about other BVS properties and just keep coming back to this one.

 

[GRPHX]

If they were to buy back the entire property from Hasbro then I might have hope for the rest of the library as well.

 

[Moe]

Power Rangers hasn't seen as most popular franchise after Mighty Morphin era ended in 1995 and Mighty Morphin was only one that I grew up and ignored most of sequels.

Hasbro properties spread into multiple distributors like Netflix, Nickelodeon and recently, Disney.