Toshiba drops HD DVD; Blu-ray wins

[En Sabah Nur]

After WB, Netflix, Wal-Mart, Target, Bestbuy and Blockbuster dropped HD-DVD and went Blu-Ray exclusive, Toshiba finally announced that they are dropping HD-DVD and officially ending the format "war".

TOKYO (Reuters) - Toshiba Corp is planning to stop production of equipment compatible with the HD DVD format for high-definition video, allowing the competing Blu-Ray camp a free run, public broadcaster NHK reported on Saturday.
Toshiba is expected to suffer losses amounting to tens of billions of yen (hundreds of millions of dollars) to scrap production of HD DVD players and recorders and other steps to exit the business, Japan's NHK said on its website.
No one at Toshiba could be reached for comment.
The format war between the Toshiba-backed HD DVD and Sony Corp's Blu-Ray, often compared to the Betamax-VHS battle in the 1980s, has slowed the development of what is expected to be a multibillion dollar high-definition DVD industry.
Toshiba was dealt a blow on Friday when Wal-Mart Stores Inc said it would abandon the HD DVD format, becoming the latest in a series of top retailers and movie studios to rally behind Blu-ray technology for high definition DVDs.
Toshiba plans to continue selling HD DVD equipment at stores for the time being but will not put resources into developing new devices, NHK said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSL1627196120080216

The rumors were true. Japanese news source NHK (english translation and Reuters validation) is reporting that Toshiba is planning to drop support of HD DVD, striking a final blow to the format and conceding victory to Blu-ray. The Sony-backed high-definition disc has been gaining strides for some time, most notably after Warner Bros switched to Blu-ray exclusively. Toshiba is expected to face hundreds of millions of dollars in losses.

http://www.joystiq.com/2008/02/16/toshiba-pulls-hd-dvd-support-blu-ray-wins/

Well, all of us who have been speculating about when HD-DVD would be a dead format have our answer — right now. Reuters is reporting that Toshiba, HD-DVD’s biggest supporter, will stop manufacturing HD-DVD hardware.
At least the death of HD-DVD was relatively quick. It took just about 6 weeks from Warner Bros’ announcement at CES until Toshiba’s announcement today.
I will be interested to see how Microsoft responds. Sony is selling PlayStation 3s with built-in Blu-ray drives for around the same price as XBOX 360s without any high definition optical drive. I can’t see them putting a Blu-ray drive in the 360, but who knows.

http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com/gadgets/?p=330

So after all is said and done, Blu-Ray wins by a knock out. All those who hesitated about buying High Definition DVDs for fear of them supporting a format that might fail, don't hesitate anymore. I for one can't wait to buy the Matrix Trilogy in Blu-Ray.

 

[Mikintosh]

They don't really win anything. Sales may go up a little bit, but it'll never replace DVDs just like laserdiscs didn't replace VHS. Sony's failed to communicate any improvements above the old format other than a somewhat better picture and the ability to choose extras while watching a movie; hardly setting the world on fire.

 

[En Sabah Nur]

They don't really win anything. Sales may go up a little bit, but it'll never replace DVDs just like laserdiscs didn't replace VHS. Sony's failed to communicate any improvements above the old format other than a somewhat better picture and the ability to choose extras while watching a movie; hardly setting the world on fire.

Laserdisc was a failed format, Hollywood did not support it. This is different. Its not just Sony, but all of Blu-Ray partners can celebrate now. And Consumers will eventually embrace the new format. Hollywood will make sure of it by pushing the format and slowly phasing out DVDs like they phased out VHS.

 

[Dogbert]

They don't really win anything. Sales may go up a little bit, but it'll never replace DVDs just like laserdiscs didn't replace VHS.

Laserdisc was a failed format, Hollywood did not support it. This is different. Its not just Sony, but all of Blu-Ray partners can celebrate now. And Consumers will eventually embrace the new format. Hollywood will make sure of it by pushing the format and slowly phasing out DVDs like they phased out VHS.

Another reason why this is different is because of Blu-Ray's compatibility with DVDs. IIRC, manufactures are not required to make BR players compatible with DVDs and CDs, but none have elected to do so and I don't expect to ever see seem them go that route. Laserdisc required a commitment to either scrap all your VHS recordings or have multiple players for the different formats. Even hold outs like myself will eventually get a BR player when the price is right because it is more like an upgrade than a replacement. The only way I see Blu-Ray not eventually overtaking DVD in hardware would be if the next format is somehow comparable in price and comes along before BR expands enough. That, however, is very unlikely.

Software is another matter. Because Blu-Ray players work with DVDs, but DVD players do not work with BRDs, there will always be a greater saturation rate for DVD. Only when we get into the 75% BR saturation range, when the non-HD stigma against DVD starts being common place, will we start seeing regular Blu-Ray exclusives.

 

[Adam Tyner]

Laserdisc was a failed format

I can't possibly consider a format that survived for twenty years and had more than 10,000 titles in its library to be a "failure".

 

[Frank Castle]

It'll still be a while before I even think about going to Blu-Ray (even though I have a PS3). My regular DVDs still look amazing on my HDTV and after all the money I've spent on my DVD collection over the last 7 years, I'm not going to repurchase the same movies on Blu-Ray so I can have a slightly better picture. I'll definitely give special consideration to a Star Wars Blu-Ray release but that's about it.

 

[Hades]

I still do not see Toshiba officially saying they have dropped HD-DVD in any of those links. WHERE is THEIR official announcement?

 

[Lord Dalek]

I can't possibly consider a format that survived for twenty years and had more than 10,000 titles in its library to be a "failure".

If laserdiscs hadn't been a moderate success, just about everything that made dvds what they are today (widescreen, surround sound, special features, etc.) would probably never exist.

 

[Adam Tyner]

I still do not see Toshiba officially saying they have dropped HD-DVD in any of those links. WHERE is THEIR official announcement?

There isn't one to post. It's coming. Be patient. The title of this thread is just a little premature.

 

[En Sabah Nur]

I can't possibly consider a format that survived for twenty years and had more than 10,000 titles in its library to be a "failure".

Most people in the homes still have a VCR and DVD player, a lot have a combo of the two. Many people won't even know what Laser Disc was. Sony MiniDisc and UMD movies are considered "failed formats", yet I still use my Hi-MD player, still buy blank MiniDiscs, and UMD movies are still being sold. So yea, I would say that LaserDisc was a failure, simply the media was too large, not many people owned the huge and overpriced players and those who did, probably don't own it now, yet they probably have a VCR/combo players.

Of course there are obvious failure formats such as Batamax and PDD for example, you can add HDDVD and TotalHD (THD) to that list as of today. I don't know how long the Record Companies can support the DualDisc without giving up on it, dual sided discs aren't very popular.

Wonder what will become of the developed but not advertised UDO format and still developing HVD format.

It'll still be a while before I even think about going to Blu-Ray (even though I have a PS3). My regular DVDs still look amazing on my HDTV and after all the money I've spent on my DVD collection over the last 7 years, I'm not going to repurchase the same movies on Blu-Ray so I can have a slightly better picture. I'll definitely give special consideration to a Star Wars Blu-Ray release but that's about it.

you don't necessarily have to rebuy all of your DVDs in Hi-Def, since PS3 and all of Blu-Ray players are backwards compatible. But you can purchase your future movies in Blu-Ray format.

 

[Adam Tyner]

Many people won't even know what Laser Disc was.

Doesn't matter. Most people don't know what an Aston Martin is either, and there certainly isn't one of those in every driveway, but it's not a failure.

Just because something isn't in tens of millions of homes doesn't mean it's inherently a failure. Laserdisc catered to a very specific audience. It was a format for hobbyists and cineastes, and as far back as I can remember (we bought our first Laserdisc player in 1984), it was never targeted towards the mainstream.

It was inarguably a success for what it was. Again, this isn't something like UMD that burned bright for a year and a half before keeling over; Laserdisc was around for 20 years and amassed an enormous library. There's no question that it wasn't the runaway success that DVD almost immediately was when it launched, but DVD was designed from the start to be a mass-market format, and Laserdisc wasn't. You can't measure them in the same way. Laserdisc was a very modest success, to be sure, but it was not a failure.

 

[Frank Castle]

you don't necessarily have to rebuy all of your DVDs in Hi-Def, since PS3 and all of Blu-Ray players are backwards compatible. But you can purchase your future movies in Blu-Ray format.

While that's certainly true, I find it hard to justify spending that extra $5-10 more to get the Blu-Ray editions. For now the DVD format is fine for me. Especially for a college student, those extra dollars saved by going with the DVD over Blu-Ray definitely make a difference. It's cool that Blu-Ray is getting more mainstream but I'm going to hold off a little longer before switching over to Blu.

 

[Hades]

While that's certainly true, I find it hard to justify spending that extra $5-10 more to get the Blu-Ray editions. For now the DVD format is fine for me. Especially for a college student, those extra dollars saved by going with the DVD over Blu-Ray definitely make a difference. It's cool that Blu-Ray is getting more mainstream but I'm going to hold off a little longer before switching over to Blu.

Dude, paying $25 for Casino Royale on BR is way worth it. Besides, people can no longer complain about the price with all of the sales that have been going on. Best Buy has had WB titles on sale for $14.99 lately.

 

[Frank Castle]

Dude, paying $25 for Casino Royale on BR is way worth it. Besides, people can no longer complain about the price with all of the sales that have been going on. Best Buy has had WB titles on sale for $14.99 lately.

Ok, I'd still rather spend $20 on a dvd than $25 on Blu-Ray. I'm not going to spend 5 extra dollars on a little uprgrade in visuals when I have student loans and other expenses. The difference between DVD and Blu-Ray isn't as substantial as VHS and DVD. I see no reason why I should upgrade right now for a slightly better picture.

And as far as the $15 WB titles go, those are past releases that I either don't care about or already have on DVD. Until the new releases are $20 or below, I'm not biting.

Also, I'd rather wait and get an actual Blu-Ray player than use my PS3.

 

[Adam Tyner]

Also, I'd rather wait and get an actual Blu-Ray player than use my PS3.

Why, if you don't mind my asking?

The PS3 is the best supported and most reliable Blu-ray player on the market.

 

[Frank Castle]

Why, if you don't mind my asking?

The PS3 is the best supported and most reliable Blu-ray player on the market.

It's simply that I'd rather just use it for games. I know that sounds weird to a lot of people but I'd like to have an actual Blu-Ray player for the movies when I do switch. Plus, it'll still be a year or two if I ever do before I switch so the players should be better and more affordable.

 

[Dogbert]

Dude, paying $25 for Casino Royale on BR is way worth it. Besides, people can no longer complain about the price with all of the sales that have been going on. Best Buy has had WB titles on sale for $14.99 lately.

The problem with pointing to sales on BRDs is that there are more sales on DVDs. If I'm willing to wait for a title to go on sale on BRD, then I'm willing to do the same for DVD. The bottom line is, How much extra am I willing to pay for HD content? For a season set of a favorite show (e.g., Heroes), I'd probably fork out an extra $10, but that's a rare case. An average movie I'd only pay a dollar or two extra to get in HD and that's a price difference several years away from happening.

For some, presumably such as yourself Hades, HD content is worth paying extra to get. Others, such as myself, would consider only paying a trivial difference in price. Others out there, likely the type of people still buying full screen movie releases, will probably get whatever is cheaper. We all have different priorities and there'll be no convincing each other that our method is wrong.

 

[sdp]

Blu-Ray will never replace DVD. HD failed to live up to the hype, fact is most people don't care. With the current economics of the US its even less likely for HD to take off with people now having other priorities when it comes to money. People will not buy their collection again, it didn't work for the music industry it won't for the movie. VHS to DVD was a drastic difference that is why it worked. With downloading video becoming more accessible in the past few years the industry is going to have to learn to adapt and give the consumers what they want or they are going to be in the same shoes as the music industry. Blu-Ray will be a successful niche market and thats about it.

I have various reasons to not support Blu-Ray, in fact I've also slowed down quite a bit on DVD purchases. But I guess its somewhat irrelevant to the thread.

 

[Storm Eagle]

I was telling one of my friends about this whole thing the other day, and she wonders why they can't just stick with DVD and just forget about HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.

Anyway, I wanted to say that my local CBS station will be discussing on the news later tonight how Blu-Ray is trouncing the competition.

 

[Adam Tyner]

I was telling one of my friends about this whole thing the other day, and she wonders why they can't just stick with DVD and just forget about HD-DVD and Blu-Ray.

She won't have to switch if she doesn't want to.

That's one of the odd things I've encountered about all of this -- a lot of people are annoyed...almost hostile...that these formats even exist. There's a persistent sense of "I don't want it, therefore it shouldn't exist".

It's an alternative, not a replacement. I do think the studios would love to have everyone throw out their DVD players and dive into Blu-ray, but that's not going to happen, and they'll service that market as long as it's there.