Looking back, was Cartoon Network's City Era really that great?

[Stumpos]

Now if you want to talk creative low points, My Gym Partner's a Monkey is a far better example. Again, not a bad show necessarily, but it's one of the most generic, mediocre, and nothing shows CN has every produced.

Even then, it was still apparently successful with its "official premiere" on February 24, 2006 being the highest rated telecast of the period.

"My Gym Partner's a Monkey" Delivers Ratings Gains for Cartoon Network - Anime Superhero News

Cartoon Network launched My Gym Partner's a Monkey -- the network's newest half-hour original animated series -- on Friday, February 24, with a two-episode premiere at 9:00pm and 9:30pm (ET). The premiere achieved solid double-digit delivery and ratings gains with kids 6-11 and kids 2-11, according

animesuperhero.com

CN's "My Gym Partner's a Monkey" Tops FRIDAYS Ratings in Third Week; TOONAMI Ratings - Anime Superhero News

Cartoon Network's newest half-hour original animated series My Gym Partner's a Monkey has climbed to the top of the prime time FRIDAYS lineup, scoring double-digit delivery and ratings among its target kid audiences vs. the 2005 time period, according to preliminary data from Nielsen Media Research.

animesuperhero.com

The fact it and Camp Lazlo still showed up on Cartoon Planet over Robot Jones, Time Squad, and Mike Lu & Og does at least put them higher on the success totem pole.

 

[Ace]

CN probably did become a little bit more corporate in this period just progressively throughout it. They became more hit and miss as time went on. Especially late in this period. The best shows were really just all the carryovers from the previous period. (Ed Edd n Eddy, Kids Next Door, Grim Adventures)

It was like their silver age not as good as gold but still worth watching a lot of it.

The bumpers of course kicked butt and so was having a lot of variety on the schedule. They had Toonami. They had a lot of variety.

 

[MTAF1976]

Cartoon Network's city era, lasting from 2004 to 2007, is fondly remembered by many fans for its brilliant premise. The brand identity, developed jointly by Primal Screen and Animal Logic, was introduced in 2004 alongside a new logo, and presented the network's programing as one big town that all the cartoon characters lived in. Bumpers would regularly have characters from various shows interacting with each-other in various skits and adventures. It gave the network a sense of community, and made CN stand out from any other channel on the cable dial.

But while the on-air packaging was fantastic, I think the actual programing during this era left a lot to be desired. 2002-2007 was an odd time for Cartoon Network as a channel. The network, which had build its house as the home to the best animation has to offer, was starting to struggle against other kids' channels like a resurgent Nickelodeon, and new cable darling, Disney Channel. As such, the network, which had once appealed to animation fans of all ages with its broad-based approach to cartoons, began segmenting its shows into walled gardens, with daytime aimed at Kids 2-11, Prime-time for 6-11, and Adult Swim over night for 18-34. The tween-skewing Toonami lineup, got kicked to Saturday nights, and in its place on Weekdays was the softer Miguzi as part of the new kid-focused mandate. Classic cartoons slowly started disappearing from the channel's lineup, replaced with more contemporary acquisitions, reruns of originals, or repurposing Kids' WB shows. And the original programing that was launched during this time was a bit of a mixed bag.

Sure, you had classics like Teen Titans, Foster's Home for Imaginary Friends, Naruto, Justice League Unlimited, Megas XLR, and Ben 10. But for everyone of those, you had completely forgettable fare like My Gym Partner's a Monkey and Hi Hi Puffy Ami Yumi, or shows with big investment, but no traction like Duck Dodgers, The Life and Times of Juniper Lee or Class of 3000. This was also the time Cartoon Network slowly began injecting live-action into its lineup, airing a variety of cartoon-like/fantasy live-action movies and some questionable acquisitions such as Zixx or Goosebumps.

I think the ultimate problem with Jim Samples' Cartoon Network was that the channel didn't know what it wanted to be. Under Betty Cohen, it was a network made by cartoon fans, for cartoon fans. Under Stuart Snyder, it was an edgy male-skewing kids network. Under Christina Miller, it was purely a kids network with an animation focus.

But under Samples... Was it a kids network? An animation channel? A kids' animation channel? A boys' network? An action network? Is it any wonder why of the dozen or so original series that came out of the City/Samples era of CN, only about three had any lasting impact. While Cohen, Snyder, and even Miller to an extent were pumping out hit after hit. It's not that the City era of Cartoon Network was bad... It's just that the network during this period had a bit of an identity crisis, and was flailing around trying to figure out exactly what it was trying to do. Meanwhile, Nick and Disney, who both had very firm and definitive mission statements during this time, were surpassing them in ratings.

I will NOT accept Duck Dodgers and HHPAY slander. I have always disliked the Samples run at CN because he tried making it like Nick towards the end of his run with crap like Gym Partner, Jimmy's Head, and greenlighting CN Real. CN City is kinda overrated but its not bad.

 

[Stumpos]

I will NOT accept Duck Dodgers and HHPAY slander. I have always disliked the Samples run at CN because he tried making it like Nick towards the end of his run with crap like Gym Partner, Jimmy's Head, and greenlighting CN Real. CN City is kinda overrated but its not bad.

Plus Toonami did end up going through a decline by around 2005 onward when they got too reliant on Naruto and the block ending up on autopilot.

Not saying Samples was bad mind you, he was fine and certainly better than Miller, Ascheim, and Oulween and he did do some good things.

 

[TheMisterManGuy]

I will NOT accept Duck Dodgers and HHPAY slander. I have always disliked the Samples run at CN because he tried making it like Nick towards the end of his run with crap like Gym Partner, Jimmy's Head, and greenlighting CN Real. CN City is kinda overrated but its not bad.

2007 was in my opinion, one of the worst seasons Cartoon Network has ever had. It was all of the worst aspects of the Jim Samples era of the network combined into one sad, pathetic year.

I don't think Samples was a bad CN president, but I definitely think he really fumbled at the end of his tenure.

Plus Toonami did end up going through a decline by around 2005 onward when they got too reliant on Naruto and the block ending up on autopilot.

This too. People rag on Stuart Snyder for killing Toonami. But the truth is, Toonami was already dying under Samples. By 2007, the whole lineup had effectively become a fancy Naruto delivery system. And it was obvious Williams Street had lost all interest in keeping it around as well since they were now busy with Adult Swim.

 

[mqg96]

Plus Toonami did end up going through a decline by around 2005 onward when they got too reliant on Naruto and the block ending up on autopilot.

2007 was in my opinion, one of the worst seasons Cartoon Network has ever had. It was all of the worst aspects of the Jim Samples era of the network combined into one sad, pathetic year.

This too. People rag on Stuart Snyder for killing Toonami. But the truth is, Toonami was already dying under Samples. By 2007, the whole lineup had effectively become a fancy Naruto delivery system. And it was obvious Williams Street had lost all interest in keeping it around as well since they were now busy with Adult Swim.

In all fairness, Naruto only got started in 2005, it premiered in September 2005, so when talking about the Toonami Saturday nights, I feel like the 2004-2005 lineups were still pretty solid, now I agree that moving Toonami to Saturdays had a negative impact long term, but it didn’t get immediately stale overnight. It was gradual you still had a good variety of anime (too many to list but we all know) plus Teen Titans and JLU really carried at the time as well. I would argue that TOM 3 era as a whole was never as strong as TOM 2 from 2000-2002 which was really the peak heyday of the block.

Even the only year TOM 3 was on the afternoon slot in 2003 wasn’t as good as the afternoon lineups of 2002 & earlier. I believe the 2003 afternoon lineups were right there with the 2004-2005 Saturday night lineups. Once Teen Titans and JLU ended in 2006, Naruto became the face of the block, and TOM 4 replaced TOM 3 (which did happen when Jim Samples was president) Toonami was in major trouble. If you ask me I believe 2006 is a most accurate starting point for Toonami’s decline as far as lineups go.

BTW, Mister Man I totally with you on 2007. Fridays being cancelled and Adult Swim becoming 7 nights were the biggest issues for me. You knew deep down inside as you were watching 2007 CN that rough times were ahead. Thankfully only for a few years.

 

[TheMisterManGuy]

BTW, Mister Man I totally with you on 2007. Fridays being cancelled and Adult Swim becoming 7 nights were the biggest issues for me. You knew deep down inside as you were watching 2007 CN that rough times were ahead. Thankfully only for a few years.

2007-2010 was such a weird period for Cartoon Network.

2007 - Jim Samples leaves Cartoon Network in complete shambles. Poor ratings, popular shows ending, newer shows mostly being crap, Nick and Disney running circles around them, and hot off of a massive bomb scare scandal thanks to Adult Swim.

2008 - Stuart Snyder comes in with a pretty good start to his regime. People forget that 2008 was a massive improvement over 2007 for Cartoon Network. Strong new lineup and better scheduling, and a new male-focused direction.

2009 - Snyder follows up 2008 with a bizzare and alienating push towards reality TV with CN Real. No new original cartoons air on CARTOON Network this year. People worried Snyder may not be the right guy to run this network.

2010 - Snyder redeems himself in a big way with one of the greatest seasons CN ever had. Jam-packed with critically acclaimed new cartoons, with most CN Real shows cancelled.

Being a CN viewer during that period was such a rollercoaster of an experience, lol.

 

[Two Two's]

For some, it was a nail in the coffin for CN's original viewers most of which, we're undoubtly late boomers-gen x and their children grew up with said classics, obviously you cannot sustain yourself by airing classics all the time. CN pretty much allowed people who were born around the same time as CN's secondary audience to make their own cartoons, all they strayed away from. 2004 was a year where CN was "cleaning out the dust" from their schedule. This obviously mean't getting rid of the sheer foundation of the network, the classics. The classics were reserved to their own timeslot at 6AM-7AM per Saturday by then, which is quite the timeslot if I do say so myself. barely anything is awake and the people that are, mainly ready to go to work or Saturday school. Obviously this timeslot was abhorrent and CN did the unthinkable and put the Boomerang block out of it's misery. This was a MAJOR and i mean MAJOR let down for CN's original audience who pretty much only watched CN for the classics, not everyone can afford premium cable might I add. Aside Looney Tunes, HB era Scooby-Doo, Tom and Jerry and oddily enough, Pink Panther, the classics were all gone from the schedule.

Issue 2: Replacement syndrome

Okay, I know Johnny Bravo did end in the City era. However, I feel like CN had other ways of replacing their legacy content. Sure the Top 5 was a thing and later on the Cartoon Cartoon Show which was the ONLY way to watch Johnny Bravo, Cow and Chicken and I Am Weasel by 2005. Even then it was random and felt like filler before they'd switch to [adult swim] or for early on weekends to fill the void that Boomerang left.


Issue 3: [adult swim].

Do not get me wrong. AS has done wonders for CN and boosted it's primetime ratings. But it's evidently clear that they were slowly introducing [as] into CN timeslot terrioity when the City era started. But yeah, [adult swim] ate the 11PM slot and was slowly approaching CN'S Friday nights, which was just encore and Courage reruns.

 

[Stumpos]

Do not get me wrong. AS has done wonders for CN and boosted it's primetime ratings. But it's evidently clear that they were slowly introducing [as] into CN timeslot terrioity when the City era started. But yeah, [adult swim] ate the 11PM slot and was slowly approaching CN'S Friday nights, which was just encore and Courage reruns.

For context, here's the evolution of how much Adult Swim gradually gained more airtime.

• September 2 2001 (the block's start): Initially on Sunday and Thursday nights from 10 PM to 1 AM
• February 23 2002: Expanded to Saturday nights from 11 PM to 2 AM
• January 11 2003: Loses Saturday nights completely in favor of SVES
• January 12 2003: Shifts to Sunday-Thursday nights from 11 PM to 2 AM
• October 6 2003: Expanded into the 2-5 AM hours
• April 17 2004: Expanded into Saturday nights again from 11 PM to 5 AM
• March 29 2005: Gains the 5-6 AM hour for 6 nights and the point where the block was split from the main channel in ratings
• October 2 2005: Gains the 10 PM hour on Sunday nights
• July 6 2007: Expands into Friday nights from 11 PM to 6 AM
• December 29 2008: Gains the 10 PM hour from Monday-Saturday
• December 27 2010: Gains the 9 PM hour, aside from December 2013 when the network briefly regained it
• March 31 2014: Gains the 8 PM hour, though main channel sometimes gained it back in November-December until 2022
• May 1 2023: Gains the 7 PM hour from Monday-Saturday
• August 28 2023: Gains the 5-7 PM hour slots on all 7 days

 

[JUS28]

@TheMisterManGuy , I'm currently friends with Tommy Snider (one of the former hosts from Fridays) on Facebook! He'd recently celebrated his birthday days ago!

Tommy Snider

Tommy Snider is on Facebook. Join Facebook to connect with Tommy Snider and others you may know. Facebook gives people the power to share and makes the world more open and connected.

www.facebook.com

 

[D. Hochoy]

No. The CN city era is mainly carried by the bumpers and the classics that were still airing when the era started (EEnE, Billy and Mandy, KND, etc.).

Aside from Ben 10 and Foster's, none of the originals really stood out. I know they have their fanbases but Camp Lazlo, HiHi Puffy AmiYumi, Gym Partner, and Jupiter are all derivative and conventional at best, and dull and insipid at worst.

Not to mention Toonami was ruined during this era when it was switched from afterschool to Saturday nights, because soccer moms complained about a lil bit of blood.

 

[Red Arrow]

I can't say anything about Squirrel Boy, But for HHPAY, I think even fans of that show can a agree that it is a very flawed series (Season one in particular). That said, it's also sort of a guilty pleasure as well for a a lot of people as well (myself included). I think it's still fun as a campy, silly celebrity cartoon, and there is an Adult Swim-esque charm to its low-budget feel since it was apparently the only American cartoon at the time animated entirely in the US.

Now I kinda want to know what the differences between season 1 and 2 were like

 

[Francisque]

No. The CN city era is mainly carried by the bumpers and the classics that were still airing when the era started (EEnE, Billy and Mandy, KND, etc.).

Aside from Ben 10 and Foster's, none of the originals really stood out. I know they have their fanbases but Camp Lazlo, HiHi Puffy AmiYumi, Gym Partner, and Jupiter are all derivative and conventional at best, and dull and insipid at worst.

Not to mention Toonami was ruined during this era when it was switched from afterschool to Saturday nights, because soccer moms complained about a lil bit of blood.

2006 was an "insipid era", to be honest, and not just on Cartoon Network

Yes, even when it comes to Disney and Nickelodeon, many people of course remember this era as there were a lot of children (obviously), but I was an "older teen" enough to know that it represented the "tweenization" of these channels with some quite banal content.
And Cartoon Network wasn't unaffected either

I remember channels would start repeating the same content much more than in the past...

 

[TheMisterManGuy]

Yes, even when it comes to Disney and Nickelodeon, many people of course remember this era as there were a lot of children (obviously), but I was an "older teen" enough to know that it represented the "tweenization" of these channels with some quite banal content.
And Cartoon Network wasn't unaffected either

I mean if anything, the lack of "tweenization" was actually a common criticism of Cartoon Network during 2006-2007.

They weren't taking the preteen audience seriously enough, allowing them to flee to both it's competitors, as well as adult channels (MTV, Fox, Discovery, even Adult Swim). Naruto was considered pretty much to only thing on CN worth watching to most tweens during this time.

 

[D. Hochoy]

I mean if anything, the lack of "tweenization" was actually a common criticism of Cartoon Network during 2006-2007.

They weren't taking the preteen audience seriously enough, allowing them to flee to both it's competitors, as well as adult channels (MTV, Fox, Discovery, even Adult Swim). Naruto was considered pretty much to only thing on CN worth watching to most tweens during this time.

Naruto was also the main reason why OG Toonami was even able to stay on air for its last few years, and that became a problem when the series was airing the infamous filler episodes.

 

[Stumpos]

I mean if anything, the lack of "tweenization" was actually a common criticism of Cartoon Network during 2006-2007.

They weren't taking the preteen audience seriously enough, allowing them to flee to both it's competitors, as well as adult channels (MTV, Fox, Discovery, even Adult Swim). Naruto was considered pretty much to only thing on CN worth watching to most tweens during this time.

In hindsight, do you think in a sense, Snyder genuinely was trying to rectify that in 2008-14 with acquired shows like Total Drama, Star Wars The Clone Wars, 6teen, and Stoked that were more edgier, live action shows from 2009-13, more action shows like the later Ben 10 shows (though Alien Force was technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Secret Saturdays (also technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Generator Rex, and Sym Bionic Titan, more action anime on Saturday mornings, and even their comedy originals were getting more edgier with Flapjack (also technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Adventure Time, Regular Show, Robotomy, Gumball, Steven Universe, Uncle Gradpa, and Clarence?

 

[TheMisterManGuy]

In hindsight, do you think in a sense, Snyder genuinely was trying to rectify that in 2008-14 with acquired shows like Total Drama, Star Wars The Clone Wars, 6teen, and Stoked that were more edgier, live action shows from 2009-13, more action shows like the later Ben 10 shows (though Alien Force was technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Secret Saturdays (also technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Generator Rex, and Sym Bionic Titan, more action anime on Saturday mornings, and even their comedy originals were getting more edgier with Flapjack (also technically greenlit at the tail end of Samples' tenure in February 2007), Adventure Time, Regular Show, Robotomy, Gumball, Steven Universe, Uncle Gradpa, and Clarence?

Yes, exactly. Snyder understood the importance of the tween audience. It's an aspirational thing. If you can get kids in their early teens to tune in, then your core 6 to 11 year old audience will want to watch too. It's why Cartoon Network focused so heavily on TV-PG rated shows in this era.

Kids always try to mimic what older audiences are doing, Nickelodeon understood that for years. Hell Cartoon Network used to get this in it's earlier years when it had stuff like Dragon Ball Z, Sailor Moon, Courage, Space Ghost Cost to Cost, etc.

The problem with the later Samples' years is that Cartoon was so focused on pandering to 6-11 year olds that it made the channel look uncool to everyone else. By the end of Samples tenure, 9-14 year olds felt like an afterthought to the network.

 

[D. Hochoy]

Yes, exactly. Snyder understood the importance of the tween audience. It's an aspirational thing. If you can get kids in their early teens to tune in, then your core 6 to 11 year old audience will want to watch too. It's why Cartoon Network focused so heavily on TV-PG rated shows in this era.

Kids always try to mimic what older audiences are doing, Nickelodeon understood that for years. Hell Cartoon Network used to get this in it's earlier years when it had stuff like Dragon Ball Z, Sailor Moon, Courage, Space Ghost Cost to Cost, etc.

The problem with the later Samples' years is that Cartoon was so focused on pandering to 6-11 year olds that it made the channel look uncool to everyone else. By the end of Samples tenure, 9-14 year olds felt like an afterthought to the network.

CN even went as far as actively sabotaging Chowder by showing it less and less, since it clearly targeted a younger audience similarly with Flapjack.

Those shows were actually creative and ahead of their time, but their potential was never realized because Snyder was deathly allergic to animation in general, and was slowly distancing CN from them by reporting to importing them from Canada rather than creating them.

The Powerhouse era definitely appealed to all ages with Toonami drawing in the older kids and teens with Sailor Moon, Dragon Ball Z, Gundam Wing, etc.

Cartoon Network during the 2004-2007 suffered from the general lack of originality that occured with western animation for that time period. Ben 10 and Foster's were however innovative, cleaver, and generally well-written.

 

[TheMisterManGuy]

CN even went as far as actively sabotaging Chowder by showing it less and less, since it clearly targeted a younger audience similarly with Flapjack.

Those shows were actually creative and ahead of their time, but their potential was never realized because Snyder was deathly allergic to animation in general, and was slowly distancing CN from them by reporting to importing them from Canada rather than creating them.

I mean in 2009, I would agree. But by 2010, you had shows like Regular Show, Adventure Time, etc. That helped reinvigorate Cartoon Network.

It's not that Snyder was allergic to animation necessarily, it's more that he was trying to completely overhaul CN and make it an actual competitor again. Doing so involves taking somewhat controversial risks. Sometimes it worked (Adventure Time) sometimes it doesn't (CN Real). But considering that Cartoon Network was actually in a very strong position by the time Snyder left in 2014, compared to where it was when Samples left in 2007, I'd say it paid off in the end.

 

[Red Arrow]

Those shows were actually creative and ahead of their time, but their potential was never realized because Snyder was deathly allergic to animation in general, and was slowly distancing CN from them by reporting to importing them from Canada rather than creating them.

This is so wrong. Adventure Time, Regular Show, Ben 10 Ultimate Alien, Generator Rex, Sym-Bionic Titan and Robotomy were all in development in 2009.