C&C - The Venture Bros. - "The Lepidopterists" [8/3]

[PickHut]

That was a pretty cool episode, and I liked how Rusty and the kids didn't even need to appear, showing how good the rest of the cast is (never said they weren't, though). The whole Monarch/Team Venture battle that took up most of the first half of the episode was really entertaining to watch, and 24 and 21 constantly telling 1 he was eventually going to die was a funny running gag. The rest of the episode was just as amusing, with everyone getting prepared for the second battle that was gonna go down at the end of the episode.

 

[Master Toon]

I'm confused

I haven't kept up with the Venture Bros much since season 3 started but I didn't know they went by a system with rules and stuff. It seems a bit dumb. And it makes it seem like villains can kill but good guys can't, unless it's under a special circumstance.

Another thing, what's up with 21 and 24? They talk about themselves as though they're fans. It's almost like they've broken the 4th wall. Even The Monarch gave them praise, so how come they aren't numbers 1 and 2?

 

[HEATXZ]

XD great episode,21 and 24 are great characters

 

[jph139]

HILARIOUS. Great characters in this one, from #21 and #24 to the Captain to the G-Men. PARTICULARLY the last two... every line out of their mouths was hilarious! My personal favorite line was probably...

Monarch: That guy needs to get a thicker skin!
Jonas Jr.: Thicker skin? Poor Ned has skin that's three INCHES thick! Now how do you think that makes him feel?
Monarch: Itchy? I dunno...

Just the way he responded had me rolling on the floor.

 

[Sandoz]

The henchman subplot was a hilarious bit of meta. Nice callback to poor Speedy. I'm kinda disappointed that Sheila is back to her Dr. Girlfriend look, but I loved how evil she looked when she said what the Guild would do to JJ.

Mr. Doe and Mr. Cardholder were great. I hope we see them again.

I haven't kept up with the Venture Bros much since season 3 started but I didn't know they went by a system with rules and stuff. It seems a bit dumb. And it makes it seem like villains can kill but good guys can't, unless it's under a special circumstance.

The Guild secretly runs the OSI, so they're not playing fair.

 

[tucsoncoyote]

Code of Honor.. Code of Honor.

I haven't kept up with the Venture Bros much since season 3 started but I didn't know they went by a system with rules and stuff. It seems a bit dumb. And it makes it seem like villains can kill but good guys can't, unless it's under a special circumstance.

In the villain/hero biz they're called Protagonists and Antagonists.. Now Antagonists can kill if they want to, but Protagonists can't because it's against their moral fiber.. but there are alway exceptions to the rule and JJ Was one of those who thought that by being an "Antagonistic protagonist" he could take down the Monarch with one shot. But with the Guild behind the Monarch, It's like Dr. Girlfriend said.. "You throw a rock, the guild responds with a knife, you use a knife, The Guild comes to kill your family." In short what I like to call,
"When push comes to shove. shove comes to Armageddon".

or what they call in the business as a "Villain/Hero Code of Honor.

Another thing, what's up with 21 and 24? They talk about themselves as though they're fans. It's almost like they've broken the 4th wall. Even The Monarch gave them praise, so how come they aren't numbers 1 and 2?

Again the reason is simple. The Monarch thinks of them as sons, and in fact like he said, they're a perfect mix of indestructible and irrational thought. The perfect blend for really any henchman. In fact 21 and 24 are what I like to call "The Murphy Law Twins.." Anything that usually goes wrong usually does but not to them.. They're like ... immortals..(like Hank was back in Tears of a Sea Cow)...

Believe me, I'm not confused.. but then I know more about the Guild of Calmatous Intent than I lead on to be.. after all I'm a card holder of the Guild..

at least my "Evil" Side is a Guild member (MUHAHAHAHA!)

 

[peterg14]

I really like this episode. Ventronic (sp?) was a Voltron/Megazord parody if I every saw one. I loved how J.J thought those wacky, comic book villian rules were dumb, which is how I feel exactly. When there's some masked werido always messing with you and your family, kill that guy. Not engage into some Tom and Jerry shenanigans, kill the guy so he's not a problem. But I guess that's what Doc Hammer is parodying and showing how stupid it is.

Ah Speedy, waaay back in the first episode that Henchman who just wanted to get his wings. With Brock out by tranqs with Speedy still in his hand, the other Henchmen couldn't get him free of Brock's grip, and 24 had to do the mercy killing. God...that sucked, it really did. But I guess now 21 and 24 realize that they're "immortal", but not like Hank and Dean with clones, just like the sons of Murphy's Law I guess.

 

[creativerealms]

I haven't kept up with the Venture Bros much since season 3 started but I didn't know they went by a system with rules and stuff. It seems a bit dumb. And it makes it seem like villains can kill but good guys can't, unless it's under a special circumstance.

Another thing, what's up with 21 and 24? They talk about themselves as though they're fans. It's almost like they've broken the 4th wall. Even The Monarch gave them praise, so how come they aren't numbers 1 and 2?

Actually the Villains cannot kill ether because of the rules. The GoCI's rules make it so villains have to arch good guys for a long time, making their lives hell, putting them in situations then can easily get out of. nether side can really kill the other. Thats why Monarch has to die, but it has to look like his death is "By the rules." Monarch has been breaking the rules by killing good guys he has been arching in cold blood because they are not Rusty Venture (See Tears of the Sea Cow.)

Everything has to be done in the over the time death trap, death ray, cheesy fashion, giving the good guys and bad guys countless chances to come out alive. I figure it's a tradition thing. And even then the idea of good guys killing at all breaks the tradition they are trying to uphold.

 

[tb4000]

What I like about this show is that the characters make meta-references, but in a subtle way, like The Simpsons used to do. It's not smiling directly at the audience, but indirectly bringing up cliches that they know are stupid.

 

[Question411]

This one ties with the Rusty's Day Care episode as my favorite so far this season. 21 and 24 are my favorite characters, after Brock. It was great to see them shine this episode. There interaction with #1 was priceless. I also like the new guys, Doe and Cardholder. The Captains new addiction was funny as well. Starting to get depressed, knowing only two more episodes left. The DVD set cannot come quick enough.
Question411

 

[Paul_Cousins]

But with the Guild behind the Monarch, It's like Dr. Girlfriend said.. "You throw a rock, the guild responds with a knife, you use a knife, The Guild comes to kill your family." In short what I like to call,
"When push comes to shove. shove comes to Armageddon".

or what they call in the business as a "Villain/Hero Code of Honor.

Anyone else see how this could spiral out of control...

 

[Scythemantis]

Ah Speedy, waaay back in the first episode that Henchman who just wanted to get his wings.

Have we ever even seen another henchman without wings?

 

[tucsoncoyote]

Sprialing out of control already! WHEEEEE! Ned Like!

Anyone else see how this could spiral out of control...

Paul It always Spirals out of control. After all remember Kim Possible vs Shego and Dr. Drakken? It seems Kim was always the protagonist to Dr. Drakken's Take over the world schemes while Drakken was the antagonist. And how many times did Drakken try to off Kim? Let's see, Killing her by having her blush herself to non-existance, sealing her in a box, using Robots and synthrodrones to do his dirty work, and yet everytime the protagonist prevailed.

Yet in the Guild's case, Like Dr. Girlfriend said, "You throw a rock, the Guild throws a knife. You throw a knife, and the Guild comes to kill your family while you are sleeping." In short what I still love to call, The Push comes to shove comes to Armageddon scenario most villains and evil doers love to do. After all sure the Monarch is henching JJ Now, but remember there's that little written rule in the Guild book that states that by Jonas Jr. becoming a antagonistic Protagonist, He's set in motion (Unknowingly) the fact that Dr. Thaddeus Venture (aka Rusty) will be his next target.

In short for this to work, the Protagonist (Namely Jonas Jr.) Decided to put the Monarch out of his misery so in a way wasn't the protagonist being a bit.. antagonistic? I think Jonas Jr. Doesn't know the rules like his Older twin brother Rusty does..After all watching Brock having to explain to JJ about how things are done was a good shot on how to study Hero/villain relations.

Of course Brock was former OSI, so heck he knows what the Guild will and won't do. Like I said, Code of Honor.

Have we ever even seen another henchman without wings?

Nope but in fact I know that if you discount the regular henchmen you have to count in Dr. Henry S Killenger (and his murderous mystical magical murder bag) comes darn close to Mary Poppins levels. and what about all those extras running Rusty's industry in The Doctor is Sin? That would qualify. And then there are Phantom Limb's Shadowmen..Oh wait, you're just refering to the Monarch's henchmen aren't you.. Okay my bad..

 

[Locomoco]

What I don't understand is who gives 'The Guild' the authority to impose their rules on any designated 'protagonist' they want? It sounded like JJ wasn't up to speed on the whole arching thing. We know from Dr. Orpheus that he applied for an arch-enemy but did JJ? If JJ did, then why is he acting all irritated at the beginning about having an arch?

 

[Anyone00]

What I don't understand is who gives 'The Guild' the authority to impose their rules on any designated 'protagonist' they want? It sounded like JJ wasn't up to speed on the whole arching thing. We know from Dr. Orpheus that he applied for an arch-enemy but did JJ? If JJ did, then why is he acting all irritated at the beginning about having an arch?

The machinations of David Bowie are beyond the ken of mortal men.

 

[CartoonSage]

Y'know, I was really rooting for #1, I wanted him to survive and proove 21 and 24 wrong cause the were so cocky... and then he ran into Brock in the museum and I gave up all hope...

 

[Paul_Cousins]

The machinations of David Bowie are beyond the ken of mortal men.

I am starting those think someone is above him in the chain of command. Someone who controls both the Guild of Calamitous Intent and the OSI from the Shadows.

As the Guild members stated in this episode. The Guild Handles the villians/antagonists, the OSI handles the heroes/protagonists.

Spoiler

That leader could be Jonas Venture Sr who controls both the Guild of Clamitous Intent and the OSI.

Years ago, he did work out the Guild of Calamitous Intent treaty nicknamed "Rusty's Law".

And Jonas did have access to cloning technology. So faking his death years ago and still leaving a body would be child's play for him.

And if this does pan out to be truth, I will be sorely disappointed if someone, like 21 and 24, does not comment on this "Darth Vader moment".

 

[TacoHunter]

I am starting those think someone is above him in the chain of command. Someone who controls both the Guild of Calamitous Intent and the OSI from the Shadows.

As the Guild members stated in this episode. The Guild Handles the villians/antagonists, the OSI handles the heroes/protagonists.

Spoiler

That leader could be Jonas Venture Sr who controls both the Guild of Clamitous Intent and the OSI.

Years ago, he did work out the Guild of Calamitous Intent treaty nicknamed "Rusty's Law".

And Jonas did have access to cloning technology. So faking his death years ago and still leaving a body would be child's play for him.

And if this does pan out to be truth, I will be sorely disappointed if someone, like 21 and 24, does not comment on this "Darth Vader moment".

I actually came to the same conclusion as well.

Spoiler

How ever, I still feel that JV Sr. is still probably dead. But I think he did lay the frame works for the Guild so that it'd give his son something to do.

 

[tucsoncoyote]

Ignore Me!

What I don't understand is who gives 'The Guild' the authority to impose their rules on any designated 'protagonist' they want? It sounded like JJ wasn't up to speed on the whole arching thing. We know from Dr. Orpheus that he applied for an arch-enemy but did JJ? If JJ did, then why is he acting all irritated at the beginning about having an arch?

Well that's a good question but then still if JJ did apply, then who better to be his arch nemesis than the Monarch himself? Though I think JJ is feigning the fact he has an arch-enemy and in the end, this could come back to haunt him as now

Spoiler

The Monarch gets to re-arch Dr. Thaddeus Venture thanks to that unforseen clause in the Guild of Calamatous Intent's handbook. You know the one. The one where if a protagonist uses a level 8 threat to kill an antagonist and the antagonist survives, then the antagonist has the right to arch a close relative who is indeed guild sanctioned, which in this case is Dr. Thaddeus S Venture.

The machinations of David Bowie are beyond the ken of mortal men.

Five Words: Dave Bowie or Soverign rocks...

Y'know, I was really rooting for #1, I wanted him to survive and proove 21 and 24 wrong cause the were so cocky... and then he ran into Brock in the museum and I gave up all hope...

It reminds you of that one line from the Faust's Inferno or whatever it is called... Abandon all hope ye who crosses paths with Brock Sampson. Because today you shall die.

I am starting to think someone is above him (David Bowie) in the chain of command. Someone who controls both the Guild of Calamitous Intent and the OSI from the Shadows.

As the Guild members stated in this episode. The Guild Handles the villians/antagonists, the OSI handles the heroes/protagonists.

Spoiler

That leader could be Jonas Venture Sr who controls both the Guild of Clamitous Intent and the OSI.

Years ago, he did work out the Guild of Calamitous Intent treaty nicknamed "Rusty's Law".

And Jonas did have access to cloning technology. So faking his death years ago and still leaving a body would be child's play for him.

And if this does pan out to be truth, I will be sorely disappointed if someone, like 21 and 24, does not comment on this "Darth Vader moment".

Tucsoncoyote: Luke, I mean Paul... I AM YOUR FATHER.. Search your feelings!

Ah yes, one of "Those Moments".

Paul Cousins: That's NOT TRUE! YOU LIE!
Tucsoncoyote: Search your feelings....Join me!

I actually came to the same conclusion as well.

Spoiler

How ever, I still feel that JV Sr. is still probably dead. But I think he did lay the frame works for the Guild so that it'd give his son something to do.

He probably wanted Rusty to have an adventurous life, but in the end, thanks to his untimely death where he probably choked to death on a Nacho, JV Senior probably had rigged the entire thing.. Or I could end up like the villainous Grand Inquistior from the Venture Brothers episode, 20 Years to Midnight...

Grand Inquisitor:
IGNORE ME!​

 

[Paul_Cousins]

He probably wanted Rusty to have an adventurous life, but in the end, thanks to his untimely death where he probably choked to death on a Nacho, JV Senior probably had rigged the entire thing.. Or I could end up like the villainous Grand Inquistior from the Venture Brothers episode, 20 Years to Midnight...

Grand Inquisitor:
IGNORE ME!​

Well that whole 20 Years to Midnight episode proves that Jonas Sr is a master at long term planning.