Before Starcrossed....

[raporfest]

Who would you have thought would betray the League?

 

[frostedone]

Aqua Man. I really disliked his JL version. He just gave off this feeling that he would do anything to protect his kingdom, even betray the League, after they helped him.

 

[Bat Bruce]

Superman. He was usually brain washed or mind controlled by someone, might as well cut out the middle man

 

[Bones Justice]

If we are talking about the original seven members, I would have guessed Batman. I don't think he really trusted the League at that point and had plans to stop all of the others. He doesn't seem like the type to trust any one person or small group to have so much power.

My other guess would be Martian Manhunter. He was almost turned by Morgan LeFey. But he seems to have overcome that.

Actually, though, I didn't even know that there was going to be a betrayal until I watched Starcrossed.

 

[DisneyBoy]

I knew Hawkgirl would betray them in the months before Starcrossed (it was kind of hard to avoid that information here), but the rest of the story was a surprise.

Honestly? I didn't think they would do a betrayer-in-the-League story. I kept waiting for the writers to turn this League into the "We all know each other's identities and are involved in each other's day lives" group I thought the League always was.

If I had to guess though, I would have guessed Hawkgirl...we knew nothing about her, and it was constantly on my mind.

 

[Lavenderpaw]

Starcrossed lovers are so awesome.

 

[Silverstar]

Aqua Man. I really disliked his JL version. He just gave off this feeling that he would do anything to protect his kingdom, even betray the League, after they helped him.

Aquaman wasn't featured prominently enough to be portrayed as a traitor.

Superman. He was usually brain washed or mind controlled by someone, might as well cut out the middle man

That only happened once, in "Legacy". Supes spent the rest of the series trying to regain the public's trust in him, no way would he ever willingly betray the team that he helped establish.

If we are talking about the original seven members, I would have guessed Batman. I don't think he really trusted the League at that point and had plans to stop all of the others. He doesn't seem like the type to trust any one person or small group to have so much power.

That would've been too obvious.

My other guess would be Martian Manhunter. He was almost turned by Morgan LeFey. But he seems to have overcome that.

J'onn came to his senses before the end of "A Knight of Shadows", and that plot didn't go beyond that one episode, so that's irrelevant.

 

[DisneyBoy]

Silverstar, there's a pretty limited list of suspects. The question was hypothetical...I think it's obvious that you can disprove everyone's suggestions.

 

[Silverstar]

Sorry, was that too much? I sometimes offend without realizing it.

What I was getting at was: the writers' choice was perfect because Hawkgirl was the last team member you'd suspect to turn traitor. The other choices were all too obvious. Since Hawkgirl was such a minor league and relatively obscure character (especially at the time of the series) that we knew so little about that making her the Benedict Arnold was perfect.

 

[DisneyBoy]

No, it wasn't offensive. Actually, I was trying to find a way to say that without it sounding like I was taking offense. I failed there

I guess I just meant that the topic by nature meant that everyone's replies could be easily argued. The idea was to see if anyone suspected someone else more, I guess.

I'm going to disagree with you on Hawkgirl being the last voice. Batman would have been the last choice, simply because he's never, ever lost it in any of his shows or episodes. He's never betrayed Dick or Babs or even Tim. For him to go and take out the League all by himself would have actually been rather cool, I think. But in the long run, it would have been a problem for the series. By giving Hawkgirl the role of betrayer, it gave the writers a direction for her character. If anything, Batman has enough angles to play off of.

 

[ROBOTRON]

- Maybe Wonder Woman?

Black Manta poisoned her with a dart...I'd thought her skin would be too tough to pierce with something as simple as a dart (much like Superman's skin).

If it that easy to penetrate her skin, who's to say that should coulda been hit with some kind of mind control serum.

 

[adoptedBatpuppy]

Any member in the original Justice League could betray the group.
With some members like: Batman, Hawkgirl, are more inclined to do so, because of the situation they are constantly in. Certain members of the League are more pressured towards betrayal then others.

 

[The Weed Of Cri]

Of the original seven, I could see Martian Manhunter turning against the rest of the League. During those first two seasons, there were a lot of hints that he just wasn't fitting in. Besides "A Knight of Shadows", there was also his telepathic freak-out in "Tabula Rasa" and the emphasis on his "otherness" in "Comfort and Joy". I thought it ironic that the one member of the League who possessed perfect natural camouflage had so much more difficulty assimilating with humans than the League's other aliens (Superman, Hawkgirl and, to a lesser extent, even Wonder Woman). Must have been the telepathy.

 

[RuneKnight3]

Of the original seven, I could see Martian Manhunter turning against the rest of the League. During those first two seasons, there were a lot of hints that he just wasn't fitting in. Besides "A Knight of Shadows", there was also his telepathic freak-out in "Tabula Rasa" and the emphasis on his "otherness" in "Comfort and Joy". I thought it ironic that the one member of the League who possessed perfect natural camouflage had so much more difficulty assimilating with humans than the League's other aliens (Superman, Hawkgirl and, to a lesser extent, even Wonder Woman). Must have been the telepathy.

Well said, although I feel I should point out that if you look at it Superman, Hawkgirl, and some of the other aliens and quasi aliens that flit through the Justice League really aren't any kind of 'alien' at all. They have by whatever means very human conceptualizations of right and wrong, loyalty and honor, to such a degree that any real 'otherworldliness' seems to me to be token. Martian Manhunter tends to break that mold because he's actively different, which is a real bonus when compared to some of his compatriots. I'll give that some morals and ethics might seem very universal, but even so their actual expression as cultural mores would be much more different. One of the reasons I like Frank Miller's representation of Batman so much in fact (DKR and DK2), is because he colors the Batman-Superman relationship with a distinct sense of class that brings back that sense of difference. Superman comes from middle class middle America, Bruce Wayne from high class third or fourth generation old money; it colors perceptions in a way no amount of alturism can disperse.

 

[Donomark]

The Flash! He's the one that'll get everyone in the end. That's how Final Crisis will end. Flash kills the whole world.

 

[Paul_Cousins]

If we are talking about the original seven members, I would have guessed Batman. I don't think he really trusted the League at that point and had plans to stop all of the others. He doesn't seem like the type to trust any one person or small group to have so much power.

My other guess would be Martian Manhunter. He was almost turned by Morgan LeFey. But he seems to have overcome that.

Actually, though, I didn't even know that there was going to be a betrayal until I watched Starcrossed.

Given the right set of curcomstances, anyone would betray anyone. That is just the nature of life.

 

[Nightwing]

Well said, although I feel I should point out that if you look at it Superman, Hawkgirl, and some of the other aliens and quasi aliens that flit through the Justice League really aren't any kind of 'alien' at all.

I'm going to have to ask for clarification of that point before I say something because it sounds like humans are more moral and compassionate than aliens, or the aliens with which we have come in contact. As far as potential likelihood and logic are concerned, I'd imagine the possibility of aliens being more mentally endowed and/or advanced is more intuitive.

I also have trouble with The Dark Knight Returns as an example in general, and also with this topic. Dark Knight Returns is crack for hardcore Batman fans, and I think that analogy holds for my particular view because it may be awesome, but I don't see it in a positive light. Batman was anti-establishment, and telling people who tried to tell him what to do to step off, and that rules, but I think the story also showed how technically unstable he is.

Given the right set of curcomstances, anyone would betray anyone. That is just the nature of life.

That's also a very Batman-esque line, and very important to keep in the back of one's mind, if you want to get to the bottom of a case with a zillion variables.

"Anyone is capable of anything given the right circumstances."

"Never turn your back on a hunch."

"When you start feeling safe, it's time to worry."

Most of that stuff is from that 'Where is Aquaman' JL storyline from a few years back, where the League disappeared and Batman had to "recast" them temporarily.

I really like the Martian Manhunter idea. I KNOW him now, sure, but who is to say that all the wonderful and beautiful afirmations of life that he had being stripped away from him wouldn't make him go happy-koo-koo-bananas.

 

[Deadman]

i most suspected hawkgirl.

 

[Bones Justice]

Hawkgirl was the last team member you'd suspect to turn traitor.

I dunno, I think Flash is the last person I would expect to turn traitor of the original seven. That guy is the heart of the team. I guess he could have been duped into it since he's kind of simple-minded but he's still the last one I would have expected, had I known there was going to be a traitor.

I do agree that Hawkgirl was a great choice but given that we didn't know much about her, she would have been on my list of suspects. Again, that's if I'd even known there was going to be a traitor in the first place. If nothing else, I could have seen her coerced by the chance to get home somehow.

 

[Paul_Cousins]

I dunno, I think Flash is the last person I would expect to turn traitor of the original seven. That guy is the heart of the team. I guess he could have been duped into it since he's kind of simple-minded but he's still the last one I would have expected, had I known there was going to be a traitor.

I do agree that Hawkgirl was a great choice but given that we didn't know much about her, she would have been on my list of suspects. Again, that's if I'd even known there was going to be a traitor in the first place. If nothing else, I could have seen her coerced by the chance to get home somehow.

Actually, kind people can become the most cruelest and vicious of villians. For good guys gone bad, being evil is like a drug. They just cannot get of enough it.

For example Evil Willow at the end of Season 6 of Buffy the Vampire Slayer, Dark Coop from Megas XLR Episode 26, Harvey Dent becoming Two-Face, and Anakin Skywalker becoming Darth Vader.

If Wally/Flash ever turns evil, you won't want to be on the same planet as he is on.

That's also a very Batman-esque line, and very important to keep in the back of one's mind, if you want to get to the bottom of a case with a zillion variables.

"Anyone is capable of anything given the right circumstances."

"Never turn your back on a hunch."

"When you start feeling safe, it's time to worry."

Most of that stuff is from that 'Where is Aquaman' JL storyline from a few years back, where the League disappeared and Batman had to "recast" them temporarily.

I really like the Martian Manhunter idea. I KNOW him now, sure, but who is to say that all the wonderful and beautiful afirmations of life that he had being stripped away from him wouldn't make him go happy-koo-koo-bananas.

The sad fact is Batman was proven right most of the time on that issue.