Teen Titans Fan Fiction Fragments (C)

[LucheLibre]

Solid advice, Shadow. Though, to be fair, as young as Rrarbecy is, his diction seems to be more advanced than most teens of today. I figure that this could be attributed to a lack of care and interest on their part. So, in that respect, he definitely deserves the praise. Your mention of his diversity is a good one.

Rrarbecy, if you are looking for a good example to chew on when it comes to writing, I suggest that you read "Vanishing Act" by Lord Welshi if you haven't done so already. You will notice that his story, in and of itself, is quite simple. However, that simple story takes on a real life beyond it's own boundaries since L.W. imagery and emotion-driven actions -devices that really only come from the words themselves- take front and center stage and draw the reader in with his own characters, almost as if they were the character him/herself. Tying in Shadow's advice, you almost want to read parts of that story out loud, just to make them even more real. Set the same standards for yourself, and you won't go wrong.

Edit: Just an after-thought, but that review of mine wasn't thorough at all. I wouldn't dare claim to be that good.

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

Solid advice, Shadow. Though, to be fair, as young as Rrarbecy is, his diction seems to be more advanced than most teens of today. I figure that this could be attributed to a lack of care and interest on their part. So, in that respect, he definitely deserves the praise.

good point, he is advanced already in his word choice and diction but considering this, it probably wouldn't be too hard for him to lean how to improve his wording, and thus make his stories all that much better. I definitly see the potential in him to do so.

-Shadow

 

[LucheLibre]

good point, he is advanced already in his word choice and diction but considering this, it probably wouldn't be too hard for him to learn how to improve his wording, and thus make his stories all that much better. I definitly see the potential in him to do so.

-Shadow

Agreed.

I am curious, what examples did you have in mind in Rrabecy's story? I am interested because diction, in the form of passive sentences and simple blocky descriptive sentences, is something that I have been harping on since I found this forum. I said a few things about it in "Evaporation" and "Remnants", but my comments went largely ignored. That was not unexpected, but I do wonder if I am approaching the matter from the wrong angle.

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

Primarily I mean in terms of dialogue. his word choice there seemed kind of limited, though there was still a bit of variety. for example:

Starfire looked up into his face as her eyes regained focus. “You okay?” asked Blue.

“I am fine, thank you,” she replied gratefully.

“Well,” said Blue, “we’ve got a battle to win.”
.......

“You can’t take me,” said Overload mockingly, “I am too powerful.”

“Wanna bet?” asked Cyborg, his sonic cannon still held out

etc...

Notice Rrarbecy does good in tacking in a bit after said or replied to keep it somewhat different, but here's a suggestion for you Rrarbecy, try this:

instead of "said Overload mockingly" try using the adjective as the verb, ie: "Overload mocked", small things like that will really help it out a lot, and it's a small, easy thing to do.

as far as being ignored about it, don't think that it is something being ignored, far from it, itis just (in my opinion) one of the hardest things to improve at overall. For example, the first story I did here on worlds finest Spurned Past, Tentative Future in my opinion was very poor in word choice. it took me the entire length of that story to get to a level where I could see significant improvment in it. The only way I have found to help with diction is to expand your vocabulary and to practice at it. as each chapter goes by you will get a little better at it each time. over time the change can be dcramatic, but the change, as stated previously is a slow prosces that takes a lot of work to succesfully improve at. pardon my pride, but here's an example from my own writing:

One year ago:

“Your security has one major flaw, it’s controlled entirely by computer. I’ve been monitoring the system remotely from my laptop. When you took it offline to upgrade it three weeks ago, I took the opportunity to install a backdoor into the system so I could come and go and have the system recognize me as friendly. Don’t worry though, I never disabled the system or went in to the tower, I only observed what I could see from the windows.”

Cyborg was seriously ticked off. He took great pride in the security system he had made and considered this a slap in the face. Robin on the other hand seemed impressed.

Beast Boy was the first to break the silence, “Dude…you’ve been watching us for the past three weeks?”

“To some extent. I never looked in anybody’s personal room, only the living room and the training rooms.”

A look of relief came over raven at that last comment. ‘At least he didn’t look in my room. No one looks in my room.’

-twitches-

Two days ago:

For what seemed like an hour they sailed over the city. Starfire began to feel as if they had been going in circles. Finally the Tameranian led her away from the city lights and over the outlying forest. Slowly they descended into the abyss. A light breeze rustled the tree tops below them.

As they passed through the tree tops, Starfire put her arms up to protect herself from the branches. It was then that she realized that her companion had let go of her long ago. The branches scratched at her chest, legs and arms. When she felt herself finally clear of the tree tops, she opened her eyes and uncovered her face. As gracefully as ever, she descended onto her feet and stood as her partner dropped down beside her.

Only he didn’t come down so gracefully. He was loosing altitude fast. As he dropped, he appeared as if on the verge of unconsciousness. He landed hard on his bad leg, sending a bolt of pain through him. He screamed from the extraordinary pain, before dropping onto his face on the ground. He struggled to lift himself off the ground with his arms, but failed with groan as he dropped back onto his stomach, sending up a puff of dust around him.

It only took one look at his wound for Starfire to know that she had to treat him fast. If she didn’t, he likely wouldn’t survive the night.

It took a year for me to improve like that, so don't expect immediate results, however with work the results will be constant.

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

Good God, Dude, you have been replying for the past half hour!

 

[LucheLibre]

I see what you mean, Shadow, and I agree. Simple dialogue imagery is a good starting point to improve diction.

One thing that I found about Rrarbecy's story that impressed me was the near lack of passive sentences. That is the side of diction that I am most concerned with, as it is perhaps one of the easiest things in diction to change. Changing a sentence from passive to active rarely, if ever, changes a sentence's meaning or place in the paragraph.

Look at Rarbecy's story and count how many times a form of the "be" verb was used, like I did just now in that sentence. I'll bet that you won't be able to use two hands. Nearly all the verbs he used were acted on by the subject. Or, to say that actively, the subject acted on the verb in nearly all of his sentences.

One instance where he did not do this provides a good example of how easy this particular part of diction is to correct.

Passive: "It was surrounded by what looked like blue fire for a moment,"
Active: "Blue fire surrounded his arm for a moment,"

That's why I like this writing device so much. One can accomplish so much just by moving the words around a little

Concerning your examples of your own writing, I do see the general improvment. However, comparing dialogue to pure imagery is a bit like comparing apples to oranges. Dialogue does not usually permit a lot of words related to imagery. Most people simply don't talk that way. Dialogue usually involves more in the line of plot or character advancment than trying to make an image in our minds, though the best dialogue sequences make an honest effort to try. Just my thoughts on the matter. But the improvement in word variety within each example is still clearly seen.

 

[LucheLibre]

*grin*

Sorry, shadow, but I had to make sure I knew exactly what I was talking about if I was going to have a real conversation. So I read the last chapter of Rrarbecy's story again and thought a lot about what I going to say.
I must thank you though for this conversation. It's the most cerebral and insightful I've been in on a discussion forum for some time.

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

Hell, I think it's the most thought provoking conversation I've had in my life! (outside of school, that is) and hopefully it should help all three of us with our writing. By the way, nice to make your aquaintence.

 

[LucheLibre]

*chuckle*

I'm glad to hear it. I know I've benefited from this conversation already. Perhaps Rrarbecy will have some things to say about our conversation. This thread may well turn into a full-blown meaningful discussion, with Rrarbecy's story providing the backbone for it all. Now that would make a great thread.

It's been a pleasure meeting you as well, Shadow. I look forward to discussing things with you in other threads of merit.

 

[rrarbecy]

Allow me to reply to each of these posts in turn.

Solid advice, Shadow. Though, to be fair, as young as Rrarbecy is, his diction seems to be more advanced than most teens of today. I figure that this could be attributed to a lack of care and interest on their part. So, in that respect, he definitely deserves the praise. Your mention of his diversity is a good one.

Rrarbecy, if you are looking for a good example to chew on when it comes to writing, I suggest that you read "Vanishing Act" by Lord Welshi if you haven't done so already. You will notice that his story, in and of itself, is quite simple. However, that simple story takes on a real life beyond it's own boundaries since L.W. imagery and emotion-driven actions -devices that really only come from the words themselves- take front and center stage and draw the reader in with his own characters, almost as if they were the character him/herself. Tying in Shadow's advice, you almost want to read parts of that story out loud, just to make them even more real. Set the same standards for yourself, and you won't go wrong.

Edit: Just an after-thought, but that review of mine wasn't thorough at all. I wouldn't dare claim to be that good.

Thank you very much

I have set those standards for myself. Vanishing Act was the first story I ever read here and it inspired me to post my stories. As anyone who's known me for a while can attest to, I love LW and Vanishing Act.

good point, he is advanced already in his word choice and diction but considering this, it probably wouldn't be too hard for him to lean how to improve his wording, and thus make his stories all that much better. I definitly see the potential in him to do so.

-Shadow

Very true. I guess that's one thing school is good for. Wow, Ghost, you're actually talking to me like a critic. I'm touched.

Agreed.

I am curious, what examples did you have in mind in Rrabecy's story? I am interested because diction, in the form of passive sentences and simple blocky descriptive sentences, is something that I have been harping on since I found this forum. I said a few things about it in "Evaporation" and "Remnants", but my comments went largely ignored. That was not unexpected, but I do wonder if I am approaching the matter from the wrong angle.

I doubt it. People close to my age are usually unresponsive to consructive criticism. But Crow is usually not one of them, which confuses me.

 

[LucheLibre]

I doubt it. People close to my age are usually unresponsive to consructive criticism. But Crow is usually not one of them, which confuses me.

Actually, in "Evaporation," Crow did acknowledge my advice and I did see an improvment over a couple of chapters. She had since slid back into her normal way of writing. This is not overly bothersome to me, though. I've made my suggestions for now and I will wait until she is done with her story to say anything else.

However, the "ignoring" I was talking about is the lack of discussion, whether in agreement or to the contrary, by anyone when I brought up those points. I would not mind being told that I don't know what I'm talking about. At the least that means that my comment was sturdy enough to form an opinion about. However, I see a problem when very, very few see any real need to give an informed opinion to the writer. The comments revolve around little more than "Kewl! Write more!" From what I've seen, that is not what the writers are looking for. You yourself can attest to that, Rrarbecy. No doubt a "Kewl! Write more!" comment is well and good to you. However, I would wager that Shadow and I's comments strike a deeper chord. You see specific things that you know to work on. You also see specific things that you are very good at and need to remember to retain.

What I wonder is whether there is a better way to encourage people to give more thought to what they post in the story threads, to discuss things of merit. I also wonder if such an endeavor would really be pointless here. That is why I ask Shadow about it. Not only is he is old enough to understand what I am talking about and its importance, but he's also been here long enough to understand the general mentality of the members here. This of course does not rule out anyone else out in giving their thoughts, though.

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

Okay, just in response to what you wree saying, here's alittle insight into what the members here tend to feel (or at least, from my oppinion)

While structured and carefully thought out comments are beyond valuble, even the basic "kewl, write more" comments do good in their own way. Structured comments help to learn what you are doing wrong, and what you are doing write, which is a great help in the long run, and writers apreciate that. "Kewl, write more!" comments may not have an obvious purpose, but they still serve to motivate the writer to do just that. it shows the writer that there are at least people reading it. Personally I would rather have 10 "Kewl, write more comments than 1 well thought out, analytical comment. This way I know that my peice is at least interesting and that people read it. Just getting one well thought out comment may mean that the peice is dull to others and is not worth continuing.

but I would prefer a balance of both kinds, you know, 2 or 3 good ones, and about 7 or 8 short ones.

does this make sense?

once again, as can be implied, this is only my perspective on this, and I'm sure that it varries from writer to writer, but it's likely to be at least somewhat similar.

as for encouraging people to post better comments...blackmail usually works best.

I admit I have used this at least twice in the past. My usual hook though is that I will write a chapter and tell everyone it is done, but I will not post it for 7 days. However, for each new reader I get, I will drop 1 day off the counter, so if after three days I get four new readers, I will post the chapter. This will usually get me one or two new readers, but it primarily fails because I am an egotistical, gullible sap.

Eventually the combination of my want to get replies about it and the pleas of the fans break through and I'll post it, usually while there are still three or four days left on the counter. (I need to work on that)

you could probably apply the same strategy to your own work, demand Seven thought out responses, and no chapter till they are there.

most of the writers here are just here for fun though. while a few may just want critiquing, many prefer just to be acknowledged and to have others read the fruits of their labor and tell them to keep up the (usually) good work.

Legal Disclaimer: I do not claim to represent anyone's opinion besides my own. If you were offend by anything I said, I appologise....blah blah blah...

-Shadow

 

[LucheLibre]

*nods thoughtfully*

I can understand that point of view, Shadow. I understand that nothing but a few well thought out posts would not be much better or worse than many simplistic ones. Going to one extreme or another rarely accomplishes anything, that much is certain.

However, even what you suggest is still greater than what occurs here. A ratio of 2 or 3 well-thought out comments to 7 or 8 simple ones would still be many times greater than what it is now. Of course, taking into account the latter portion of your post, this point may well be moot.

While it's true that writing fanfics is fun work and some want little more than confirmation of that, it is also true that a large portion of the works here on this forum have taken a very long time to think about and write. Most of those authors almost beg for meaningful feedback and get almost nothing in return. I know I would feel nothing but frustration if I wrote something and got little but "Kewl! Write more!" replies. A few would be fine, but, like any repetition, it looses its punch. I would think that all but the most casual of writers would think the same at least at one point in their writing.

In the end, though, these things remain: most folks write some good stuff here at TZ and I most definitely enjoy the product of their effort. I will be one more voice to commend and advise those who desire it. For those who don't, then I will read and enjoy, anyway. I'm sure you feel the same way, Shadow. Once again, I have to say it's been a pleasure talking with you.

Now if only someone will come in here and berate me for my long-winded preaching...

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

I definitly see your point about hardwork deserving more than simplicity, and agree with it.

as for that whole prattling schpeel, (or however the hell you spell it)I think everyone else is just in shock from seeing long responses. That or their brains exploded outright from actually thinking about what is being said). hopefully not though, that could be rather messy.

but if it makes you feel better....

show off...

-Shadow

 

[LucheLibre]

*laugh*

You spoil me, Shadow.

As a side point relating to our discussion, though, I encourage you to look at the feedback in Kodra's "Epilogue" thread. Kodra is not content with just taking the feedback, but actually gives feedback to the feedback. I thought it quite insightful when he/she asked about why someone would really like a Robin/Raven story when normally they would hate such a thing. Something like that really digs down, don't you think?

 

[ShadowOfAGhost]

yeah, that and it's unusual for the author o ask questions back. commenting is n't that uncommon, but doing what he/she/it does, is.

-Shadow

 

[rrarbecy]

However, the "ignoring" I was talking about is the lack of discussion, whether in agreement or to the contrary, by anyone when I brought up those points. I would not mind being told that I don't know what I'm talking about. At the least that means that my comment was sturdy enough to form an opinion about. However, I see a problem when very, very few see any real need to give an informed opinion to the writer. The comments revolve around little more than "Kewl! Write more!" From what I've seen, that is not what the writers are looking for. You yourself can attest to that, Rrarbecy. No doubt a "Kewl! Write more!" comment is well and good to you. However, I would wager that Shadow and I's comments strike a deeper chord. You see specific things that you know to work on. You also see specific things that you are very good at and need to remember to retain.

I hope that was sarcasm. I hate replies like that.

 

[Faethie]

Nice chapter Becs.....even if you forgot Beast Boy...
tho a 'zzzzttt' thing would've been cool .....

erm.....

 

[Kodra]

LucheLibre, ShadowOfAGhost, wonderful dialogue on the duties of readers to authors. I've taken the liberty of creating a thread in the workshop area for this type of discussion to take place. This thread however, seems more suited for commenting on the fanfiction laid before us.

Rrarbecy, I managed to make it to the end without throwing my hands up in disgust, so you get points in that regard. Your paragraphing seems fine, I don't see too much in the way of a weak sentence structure (though I'm certainly not an english major).

I think you have a fairly well defined character in Blue. Now how much of that character really makes sense to me is in question. First off, he seems extremely bold for someone who has no sense of himself. It strikes me as unrealistic to see a person who has no memory to be acting in such a bold outgoing way.

Also, I think the Titans would be less than receptive of someone who approached them asking to be made a part of their group. Whenever they accept someone in, it's someone who's already proven themselves outside of the Titans organization. They generally have them prove themselves first, then accept them in.

Finally, the story seems to be very Blue-centered. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth when an Original Character takes the spotlight in a fanfiction, the only exception being if that original character has already been long introduced in a previous fanfiction in which they weren't the center of attention. I'm a big supporter of passing the spotlight around and focusing in on all of the Titans. In this, every single scene has contained Blue or has been about Blue.

Hope this helps you with your writing. Keep it up.

~Kodra

 

[rrarbecy]

Rrarbecy, I managed to make it to the end without throwing my hands up in disgust, so you get points in that regard.

Erm...thank you? I'm not sure if that's an insult or a complement.