"Supergirl" Season Five Talkback (Spoilers)

[Yojimbo]

"Deus Lex Machina" - Episode 17
Lex proceeds to lay an intricate plan to bring Lena closer to him, defeat Leviathan’s latest attack, and pit Supergirl and team against Leviathan. It is also revealed how Lex came into power after Crisis.

 

[Fone Bone]

Supergirl "Deus Lex Machina"

Great episode title.

The Luthors are the one corner of the Arrowverse Oliver Queen neglected to clean up when he rebooted the Universe. I don't care if the Monitor owed Lex a favor, he was dead. Oliver should have put it right.

I liked seeing the footage of Brandon Routh and Tom Welling from Crisis On Infinite Earths.

I love Lex promising to carrying out all of Eve's dirty work. She didn't seem to understand that actually makes him a bad guy which is why I think she's an idiot.

Lex's plan against Leviathan doesn't actually suck, which is something I like.

How dumb is Eve? She thinks the lab mice are cute and instantly gets attached. Did I mention she's an idiot?

Lex asks if Lillian questions his will. If she doesn't I will. His Superman obsession is a weakness and proves how petty and small his will actually is. It's why he's going to lose. Him calling it inspiration is outright delusional. It's why he sucks.

I liked Lena's tentative sympathies to Kara and I like that Lex didn't. Of course she overreacts to Supergirl using Myriad, but frankly Kara SHOULDN'T be using it. Lena isn't actually wrong to be upset. She goes too far in believing it to be a personal betrayal, but Kara's still a hypocrite.

Lex killed Jeremiah? I could have sworn that was Dean Cain's online behavior.

I didn't bother reading the opening credits so M'Gann's appearance was a surprise.

Lex's plan against Leviathan is good but his treatment of Tess is completely counterproductive. She's already devoted to him. He could have let her down gently and she'd still serve him faithfully. Instead he has to rub her nose in how much smarter than her he is and now she has an actual excuse to turn against him when the time is right. Stuff like that is why I hate this version of Lex Luthor. He's unnecessarily cruel because he enjoys it, and is too dumb to understand it will ultimately hinder his goals. I don't know what Kevin Smith is smoking by praising Jon Cryer so highly on the Crisis Aftershow recently. The Arrowverse probably contains my least favorite Lex Luthor ever.

But everything else was all right. I'm curious how the aborted season will actually be able to wrap up.***1/2.

 

[hobbyfan]

Eve has always been portrayed as being naive to a point, but now she's a stereotype in your opinion?

Let's remember that the storylines are dumbed down to have room for unnecessary soap opera.

But, going by your description, Fone Bone, Eve is being written like she was Lex's girlfriend-secretary from the 1988 Superman animated series, Jessica Morganberry, who was a stereotyped ditz.

 

[Fone Bone]

Eve has always been portrayed as being naive to a point, but now she's a stereotype in your opinion?

I never said that once in my post. It is not in my nature to throw out the descriptor "stereotype" about a female character. That is not an all right thing to do, even if the character sucks.

 

[hobbyfan]

You wondered why Eve was "dumb" because she thought the lab mice were cute. While you didn't subscribe to the notion of a stereotype, there are those besides me who might think you did. They might be lurkers for all we know.

FWIW, it might've been fun if they really wanted to shock viewers and insert Pinky & The Brain into that scene.......

 

[Fone Bone]

You wondered why Eve was "dumb" because she thought the lab mice were cute. While you didn't subscribe to the notion of a stereotype, there are those besides me who might think you did. They might be lurkers for all we know.

It's not a stereotype at all. Because real women aren't that dumb. It's bad writing.

 

[Yojimbo]

"The Missing Link" - Episode 18
Supergirl and the team go head to head against Rama Khan and Leviathan. Meanwhile, Lena and Lex must join forces when Project Non Nocere fails, leaving the two siblings in serious danger.

 

[Fone Bone]

Supergirl "The Missing Link"

Sean Astin! Yay!

I keep thinking Lex thinks he has more juice with Brainy than he actually does. But then Brainy does what he says anyways and proves me wrong.

I don't think the science of the predatory environment triggering the prisoners holds up. To be honest, I don't demand realism from the science in my superhero shows. But there should be an underlying logic to it at least. This has none.

Lex is a surprisingly good fighter.

For some reason I always find myself sympathizing with bad things happen to Steve. And I'm not sure why that is.

I will NEVER ship J'onn and M'Gann. NEVER. Ick.

DEO got blowed up good. Big things happening.

I'm not all that impressed with Lena's apology to Kara at the end. If she weren't such a petty, weird, self-absorbed idiot, she never would have had to make it at all.

After Lex screams in her face, her calling him a monster and refusing to become one felt entirely wrong. And you know I didn't write the episode. Because I would have had her turn to him and say "Dude, say it, don't spray it." Admittedly less pathos in that quip, but it would have been the proper response to that hammy, overacted nonsense.

Passable episode but some of it rubbed me the wrong way. ***.

 

[hobbyfan]

We should not be surprised that Lex tried to maneuver everything so he'd win at the end. Now, who does that sound like in real life? Hint: The writers took shots at him last season.

In the books, M'gann is, like, an adoptive cousin of J'onn's, IIRC. The romance here is because they need a "power couple" of some kind on this show, now that Brainy & Nia are quits. For now.

William gets black-bagged and snatched. I don't think Lex knows that Eve might be playing him for a sucker, too.

The DEO will eventually be rebooted somehow. Yes, it was dismantled in the comics last year, involving a different iteration of Leviathan, but these things have a way of righting themselves.

After the season finale, you may have to wait a year for season 6. With Melissa's pregnancy, coupled with the uncertainty of resuming filming, I'm guessing the show will return as a summer series in '21.

 

[Yojimbo]

"Immortal Kombat" - Episode 19 [Season Finale]
Supergirl realizes that in order to stop Lex and Leviathan she must work with the one person she never thought she'd trust again – Lena. Nia keeps dreaming about Brainy but struggles with what the dreams are trying to tell her. Meanwhile, Brainy realizes there is only one way to stop Lex.

 

[hobbyfan]

Didn't think they would tease killing Brainy (who's never been killed off in the books that I know of). I guess it's an excuse to get him & Nia back together.

Redemption arcs for Lena & Eve. Unfortunately, Lex now has Lillian at his side. If they go full bore with the Luthor family feud, maybe Steve Harvey can be brought in.......! Not!

 

[Fone Bone]

Supergirl "Immortal Kombat"

Lex's gifts as a criminal mastermind are completely overstated. He still NEEDS Brainy. Why would he tell him he plans to let his friends die? How stupid is he? It's why I hate this Lex. He'd rather be cruel than smart. It also makes him insufferable.

Case in point. If he hadn't humiliated Tess and threatened to kill her mother she never would have turned on him. She would have been loyal to the end, and never given the heroes that crucial bit of information. The only thing Lex's cruelty accomplished was making sure his most loyal assistant would betray him. And that's why I hate this Lex so much. If he were actually better at this I probably wouldn't.

Lex does one of those cliched and annoyed "I planned for everything" bogus Xanatos brags that that character always did after getting spanked. Really Lex? Then why are you so surprised and upset Brainy didn't let his friends die? I think the biggest reason I hate the concept of the Xanatos Gambit, is that 9 times out of 10, it's pure false bravado. Xanatos repeatedly claiming victory after clearly getting repeatedly beaten isn't the sign of a clever villain. I certainly don't think Pee-Wee Herman is a criminal mastermind for falling off his bike and saying "I meant to do that." It's true Lex now has the shrunken Elementals. But don't tell me he planned for that or that it was his preferred outcome. This version of Lex is unbelievably pathetic.

I'm currently watching Horde Prime's genius psychological manipulations on She-Ra and the Princesses of Power and he puts Lex to shame as far as smart and effective villain goes. She-Ra IS an unusually smart show but it's bad if a kids cartoon is running rings around you are far as complex villains go. It's embarrassing.

I can't believe the producers think heavy eyeshadow is enough of a mask for Alex. I hate superhero shows.

I'm glad Kara brought up the Deathly Hallows parallels herself. I was gonna say.

I suppose I am very happy about Kara reading Lena the riot act, but frankly, it was too late for me. I wanted her to say these things all season long instead of constantly apologizing to and for her. And she doesn't actually want to go on the rant even now, except Lena is starting to turn everything about herself per usual and that will get her friends killed so she has to make the "Why you suck" speech curt and on-point. But I do like that she seemed annoyed to be forced to have to stop everything and give it on Lena's timetable. I liked that very much. Lena is a freaking chore of a person.

I don't agree with Kara forgiving her at the end. But after she stands in front of her and tells Shadow she'll have to go through her to get to Supergirl I can acknowledge Kara doing that isn't actually unreasonable. It may be just a start, but it was a significant start. I would not might seeing Lena outright redeemed on this show. It would be pleasantly unexpected. I will always hate the character but I would dig the idea of the show pulling back from turning her into Kara's archenemy. I don't think the show has been better for that this season at all, so perhaps the show pulled back because they realized it wasn't working. You give a villain a lousy motivation to be a villain, surprise, the audience doesn't like them. They must have seen how badly Lena came across for her whining and issued a course correction to play up Lex instead. It's probably for the best, and I hope it's the end of that nonsense. The franchise made unexpected heroes out of Toyman and Killer Frost. I would not object to them offering a benevolent version of Lena Luthor too.

I did not like the idea that Supergirl seemingly got through to everyone in the simulation. In reality, she'd convince 60% tops. About 40% of the population of Earth is irrational and unwilling to listen to reason. Despite last season being a parable against Trump, this plot turn tells me the writers have learned nothing about people in the last three years.

Out of the Arrowverse shows, this felt the least like a finale, mostly because Brainiac 5's fate was so up in the air. Life and death cliffhangers are common among many shows, but not Arrowverse shows. The cliffhangers there (outside of the Prometheus season of Arrow) are done to set up the next season rather then leave us on the hook. Plus, if a finale had done that, they would have made the stopping point for his story more pointed and memorable. I feel very aware that he would have been rescued at the beginning of the next episode had it existed.

That was all right, but I think Lex Luthor is the single worst villain in the entire Arrowverse. They seem to have him do things to show how evil he is and how impressed I should be by that. Instead, I think he's a stupid goon who couldn't pour piss out of a boot with instructions written on the heel. I really hope when the show comes back after the virus and Melissa Benoist's pregnancy, that Lex is gone. He makes the show worse. He's crazily somehow even more detestable than Captain Liberty. But although Captain Liberty was an equally vile person, he was a better character because he was effective, as unbelievable as some of his lucky breaks were. Lex just makes everything worse for showing up. Jon Cryer is the single worst Lex Luthor in live-action or animation. Kevin Smith must be smoking serious chronic to think otherwise.

Hopefully next season will be better. ***1/2.

 

[hobbyfan]

That was Agent Liberty last season, FB. And you're in the minority as far as Cryer goes. Yes, his characterization of Lex is flawed, as in the post-Crisis reset he now has mommy in his corner like he always wanted. In the books, Lex was never presented as a mama's boy. You have someone like Jay Faerber, with comics writing on his resume, as a producer, and you'd think he'd be more familiar with the source material.

They will start season six next year by finishing the current arc, and then, we'll figure it out, but here's a good idea. Jeph Loeb (& 9 Stories) is available after leaving Marble TV, so maybe they can bring him in.......